Cold air intakes

Topic: Cold air intakes (Read 34608 times) previous topic - next topic

Cold air intakes

Reply #90 – October 03, 2014, 12:54:29 PM

Quote from: V8Demon;438598

Get in something that's relatively slower for a while and drive it on the regular. Taking the toy out after that will give you an appreciation for it and the want for even more.

Got that right! My daily is a whopping ~70hp peak, and with no way to improve that figure. Not terrible at 2000lbs with full gas and driver, but only its decent handling keeps the car somewhat enjoyable. Either way, it takes me 30-40 minutes for the 9-mile commute, so more power wouldn't get used. Hoping to get the tbird's mods completed this weekend, and take it out Sunday for the first time since early 2013. Exhaust piping may cause a problem though...

Cold air intakes

Reply #91 – October 03, 2014, 02:03:39 PM

Quote from: Seek;438615

Exhaust piping may cause a problem though...

Nope. Leave it all off. Open headers. Zero eff's given. Bill O'Reilly style DO IT LIVE!!!!! Get out and rip before the winter comes.
Oh wait, you're in Oregon. You don't have to deal with salt like we do over here. I hate you. Go to hell. LOL

Cold air intakes

Reply #92 – October 03, 2014, 11:04:02 PM

Quote from: V8Demon;438598

Get in something that's relatively slower for a while and drive it on the regular. Taking the toy out after that will give you an appreciation for it and the want for even more.

FWIW -- I've found a Mustang set up almost identical to mine save for an aftermarket converter. Same trap speeds and MUCH better 60 foots on what should be less aggressive rubber for the track. He had a LOW 1.6 60 ( I'm in the high 1.7's) and 11.7's all day long. I'm ordering my converter this week. 4000 RPM stall here I come.

Are you running drag radials on your Cougar? There is no way I'm cutting anything lower than a 2.0-2.1 60' on street tires. Hell right now if the car is rolling along at 10-15mph if I boot it the car will spin the tires.

Cold air intakes

Reply #93 – October 03, 2014, 11:07:53 PM

Quote from: ZondaC12;438606

OH AND BTW!!!! Took the Carquest paper filter out of the black car and drove it a mile or two last night. Didn't notice an appreciable difference in acceleration. And it definitely just...stops at 5500. Hesitates and then kiiiiinda wants to keep accelerating just a little but it's over. So yah...I guess I'm alright. I might think of getting a different cam at some point, have another 700 rpm until the limiter...

Actually if you remove the filter the MAF will get some weird signals and just peg at some point. Put the filter back in and I bet it pulls higher in the rpm range. Heck even mine pulls past 5500.

Cold air intakes

Reply #94 – October 04, 2014, 03:32:44 AM

Quote from: thunderjet302;438631

Are you running drag radials on your Cougar? There is no way I'm cutting anything lower than a 2.0-2.1 60' on street tires. Hell right now if the car is rolling along at 10-15mph if I boot it the car will spin the tires.

Just curious - back when my car was my daily and still had gt40p heads, HO cam, 3.55 gears, 4r70w with stock 12" converter, and sitting on a set of $700 225/60/R16 tires (not cheap junk), I had no problems breaking traction at 40mph - in the summer. It would not stick again unless I let off the throttle. I could never go WOT in traffic due to his persistent problem. My witness was the person I used to carpool with everyday. I'd think you'd have a much easier time breaking traction with the mods in your sig?

Also, yeah - the mass air sensor will not read correctly unless it gets steady airflow through it - turbulence completely throws things like that off.

Cold air intakes

Reply #95 – October 04, 2014, 09:47:10 AM

Even with the filter in, it's definitely done at 5500.
Maybe that is another problem. http://static.trickflow.com/global/images/chartsguides/t/tfs%20dyno%20tfs-k514-360-350%202014c.pdf Torque drops right off past 5K, but I wonder if that would really cause it to hit a wall like it does. Maybe I'm losing fuel. I know *nothing* about the fuel pump in the car other than that it sounds no louder/angrier than a stock one.

Cold air intakes

Reply #96 – October 04, 2014, 10:17:35 AM

Quote from: thunderjet302;438631

Are you running drag radials on your Cougar? There is no way I'm cutting anything lower than a 2.0-2.1 60' on street tires. Hell right now if the car is rolling along at 10-15mph if I boot it the car will spin the tires.

Currently running Maxxis Marauder MA-S1's on the Cougar. I drive it in the rain; usually cause I get stuck in it on the way home from wherever I went. It has to be really dry with almost ZERO humidity for me to stand on it....

I run M&H Racemasters on the Mustang. Love them!

Cold air intakes

Reply #97 – October 04, 2014, 02:05:32 PM

Quote from: Seek;438638

Just curious - back when my car was my daily and still had gt40p heads, HO cam, 3.55 gears, 4r70w with stock 12" converter, and sitting on a set of $700 225/60/R16 tires (not cheap junk), I had no problems breaking traction at 40mph - in the summer. It would not stick again unless I let off the throttle. I could never go WOT in traffic due to his persistent problem. My witness was the person I used to carpool with everyday. I'd think you'd have a much easier time breaking traction with the mods in your sig?

Also, yeah - the mass air sensor will not read correctly unless it gets steady airflow through it - turbulence completely throws things like that off.

When I say boot it I mean press the throttle half way down and hold it there. Floor it means full throttle, at least in my mixed up definition

.

When I had GT40P heads no way was the car breaking traction at 40mph. A full throttle down shift from 4-2 at 40mph would bark the tires. Now a 4-2 full throttle down shift at 40mph barks the tires and there is a slight bit of wheel spin. It's not loosing so much traction at 40mph that it just spins. Heck even my Mustang with 305hp and 3.31 gears doesn't spin the tires at 40mph. Maybe you guys have slicker streets in the Pacific Northwest? You guys do have quite a bit more rain/humidity than we do. Perhaps it does something to the pavement? All the winter salt here makes our pavement rough as hell.

Cold air intakes

Reply #98 – October 04, 2014, 02:09:33 PM

Quote from: V8Demon;438647

Currently running Maxxis Marauder MA-S1's on the Cougar. I drive it in the rain; usually cause I get stuck in it on the way home from wherever I went. It has to be really dry with almost ZERO humidity for me to stand on it....

I run M&H Racemasters on the Mustang. Love them!

Can you get traction from a stop in 1st gear when it's wet outside? The couple of times I've been caught in the rain with the Thunderbird 1st gear was useless from a stop. I had to start in 2nd gear to get any traction. I tried to pass someone when traveling 45mph in the rain and the 4-2 down shift at 3/4 throttle sent the car sideways. Scared the out of me.

Cold air intakes

Reply #99 – October 04, 2014, 02:13:54 PM

Quote from: ZondaC12;438644

Maybe I'm losing fuel. I know *nothing* about the fuel pump in the car other than that it sounds no louder/angrier than a stock one.

Good point. I washiznitting like 95% duty cycle on my 24lb injectors, at 39psi, 5000rpms, and 12.6:1 AFR. I expect to hit a wall after installing my new torque converter and increasing the shift point to 6k. I have 30lb injectors to go in now - it was needed before, and more so now with the new intake and TW170 heads.

I'm guessing you don't have a wideband? Have you tuned the combo at all? At 11.5 AFR, you will be using even more fuel, and missing quite a bit of power.

On the earlier note - I ran the car open-headers to pump the fluid out of the transmission pan. In a garage. Sounded beautiful, and ran much smoother. I probably have catalytic converter issues with the old pipes. I got them used many years ago with unknown mileage. For all I know, they've been pretty clogged this entire time.

Cold air intakes

Reply #100 – October 04, 2014, 02:17:23 PM

Quote from: ZondaC12;438644

Even with the filter in, it's definitely done at 5500.
Maybe that is another problem. http://static.trickflow.com/global/images/chartsguides/t/tfs%20dyno%20tfs-k514-360-350%202014c.pdf Torque drops right off past 5K, but I wonder if that would really cause it to hit a wall like it does. Maybe I'm losing fuel. I know *nothing* about the fuel pump in the car other than that it sounds no louder/angrier than a stock one.

Mine pulls all the way to the end of the digital tach. We all know that it's really accurate. Especially since the tach on the dash shows 800rpm when idling in park and a tach/dwell meter shows 625rpm. Not off at all

. I bet mine is probably done around 5500rpm as well. I think after the rear end build I'm going to get a nice custom cam and a Performer RPM II intake. I want to be able to make power up to 6000rpm, at least.

Cold air intakes

Reply #101 – October 04, 2014, 02:50:37 PM

Quote from: thunderjet302;438653

Mine pulls all the way to the end of the digital tach. We all know that it's really accurate. Especially since the tach on the dash shows 800rpm when idling in park and a tach/dwell meter shows 625rpm. Not off at all . I bet mine is probably done around 5500rpm as well. I think after the rear end build I'm going to get a nice custom cam and a Performer RPM II intake. I want to be able to make power up to 6000rpm, at least.

Ah - another good point. I tune from datalogs - the EEC knows exactly what rpm it's at, so there isn't an accuracy issue there. Going off of typical gauges, stock or otherwise, you have no idea where you are ever truly at.

On a random note - there is no fuel savings by running at 570rpm idle over 625. Lower than that doesn't idle well... :p

Cold air intakes

Reply #102 – October 04, 2014, 04:19:57 PM

Quote from: Seek;438652

Good point. I washiznitting like 95% duty cycle on my 24lb injectors, at 39psi, 5000rpms, and 12.6:1 AFR. I expect to hit a wall after installing my new torque converter and increasing the shift point to 6k. I have 30lb injectors to go in now - it was needed before, and more so now with the new intake and TW170 heads.

I'm guessing you don't have a wideband? Have you tuned the combo at all? At 11.5 AFR, you will be using even more fuel, and missing quite a bit of power.

On the earlier note - I ran the car open-headers to pump the fluid out of the transmission pan. In a garage. Sounded beautiful, and ran much smoother. I probably have catalytic converter issues with the old pipes. I got them used many years ago with unknown mileage. For all I know, they've been pretty clogged this entire time.

Haven't even a clue as to any feedback. I have no equipment to read the ECM nor do I want to spend the money. Who knows if I'll ever want to spend the money. Sure I'll use it in the future but that first step is so hard to take, to convince yourself it's worth spending hundreds just to talk to your ECU. If I want a dyno tune, I have to go down to the NYC area. There are a couple shops around here, but they're all patently incompetent, and I don't think any of them do Ford EEC-IV.

Cold air intakes

Reply #103 – October 04, 2014, 05:05:41 PM

Quote from: Seek;438654

Ah - another good point. I tune from datalogs - the EEC knows exactly what rpm it's at, so there isn't an accuracy issue there. Going off of typical gauges, stock or otherwise, you have no idea where you are ever truly at.

On a random note - there is no fuel savings by running at 570rpm idle over 625. Lower than that doesn't idle well... :p

I've set mine (just doing a base idle reset as I have no tuning equipment) to idle at 625rpm in park, and 600rpm in drive with the parking brake on. It fires right up hot or cold like a stock 5.0. Any lower than that and I had to hold the throttle open a bit to start the car and any higher and it surged a bit when coming to a stop. The car really needs a tune though. It's a bit rich at idle (I can smell it) and I'm pretty sure it's probably a bit rich through the entire rpm range.

Cold air intakes

Reply #104 – October 04, 2014, 06:03:41 PM

Quote from: thunderjet302;438657

I've set mine (just doing a base idle reset as I have no tuning equipment) to idle at 625rpm in park, and 600rpm in drive with the parking brake on. It fires right up hot or cold like a stock 5.0. Any lower than that and I had to hold the throttle open a bit to start the car and any higher and it surged a bit when coming to a stop. The car really needs a tune though. It's a bit rich at idle (I can smell it) and I'm pretty sure it's probably a bit rich through the entire rpm range.

If I remember right, the MAF EEC always shoots for around 11.6:1 AFR, after cold start. AFR's are closer to 10-10.5:1 on cold start, for quite awhile. It learns your engine changes based on feedback in closed loop. Many times, your engine may actually be running a point leaner than that, and this is when it would make the most power. This was my experience, with different sets of sensors - they appeared to be reporting correctly according to datalogs, but my car would run leaner in the evening than in the morning. Different MAF sensors didn't help, and neither did 19lb vs 24lb injectors. Good power is obtained by getting to ~12.5 AFR, rather than living around 11.5.

The stock tune of the EEC shoots for 672rpm in idle, and 624rpm in drive. If you are adjusting the TB screw, the EEC will compensate with the IAC, until it can no longer do so. If you have a true 600rpm in drive, your IAC is either disconnected, or pegged, as the EEC tries using it to to raise the rpm's to the proper level. This will make your idle quality suffer. If you unplugged the IAC, adjusted the TB screw to that level, then plugged the IAC back in, the EEC should be able to control idle correctly, and you will be at the above target idle rpm's.

Dyno tuning also won't get a car dialed in for anything but WOT, and it doesn't account for all of the variables that are not in effect the day that the dyno tune was performed. General drive-ability needs a lot more tuning work to get running well. I figured it was worth the few hundred dollars to be able to get good drive-ability, and datalog far more than what most dyno tuners are capable of seeing from the EEC IV systems. If I felt something weird on a drive, I would go home and review the log to see what the cause was, and make any adjustments as necessary. Fun stuff!