Time for some new ignition wires Reply #15 – October 30, 2014, 12:49:34 PM I still think it has something to do with the runner design. I remember pulling plugs when I had GT40P heads and #7 looked similar. In both instances the plug is not fully orange/brown like yours but has a slight tint on one side. I moved the injectors around with the head swap so I know it can't be the injector. The car passes a cylinder balance test fine so I just ignore it. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #16 – October 30, 2014, 12:51:31 PM Did some reading and it seems like a few people have issues with #3 & #7 with these intakes. I saw more complaints on the #7 cylinder being lean than any other. One guy posted up that #7 & #8 fire sequentially and that if you have the wires bunched up together and the wires are bad it can cause those two cylinders to fire at the same time. Just food for thought. Also, cylinders #7 & #8 are the last to get fuel so you may want to step up to those 30 lb/hr injectors and tune it.I run 42's on my Coupe with a 255 lphr pump, stock lines, & stock rails and believe me it is not lean. Took the tuner no time at all to get it right and it fixed my issue of the motor just laying over at about 5,200 rpm when I had the 24 lb/hr injectors.Darren Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #17 – October 30, 2014, 12:58:57 PM So this is a GT40 intake issue? And my car is probably leaning out a higher RPM. I'm kinda surprised the 24lb injectors aren't enough. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #18 – October 30, 2014, 01:03:07 PM Quote from: Seek;439907So the parts store wires are doing no better. I routed them differently, and re-gapped my plugs from .050 to .045. Cap and rotor still looked new.Wires just thrown in, but placed away from as many metal surfaces as possible:Wires put into plastic retainers to keep them in place...I couldn't get the coil to distributor routed well, so it's arcing on the intake:It idles a little better (maybe), but I still hear an issue through the exhaust note. All of that may simply be me having no o2 sensors in, and no wideband for monitoring, so I could be dumping a little extra fuel into the exhaust and getting some ignition there.What brand wires are those? Like I said I switched to MSD 8.5mm Super Conductor wires and have no more light show. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #19 – October 30, 2014, 01:07:25 PM Quote from: Aerocoupe;439940Did some reading and it seems like a few people have issues with #3 & #7 with these intakes. I saw more complaints on the #7 cylinder being lean than any other. One guy posted up that #7 & #8 fire sequentially and that if you have the wires bunched up together and the wires are bad it can cause those two cylinders to fire at the same time. Just food for thought. Also, cylinders #7 & #8 are the last to get fuel so you may want to step up to those 30 lb/hr injectors and tune it.I run 42's on my Coupe with a 255 lphr pump, stock lines, & stock rails and believe me it is not lean. Took the tuner no time at all to get it right and it fixed my issue of the motor just laying over at about 5,200 rpm when I had the 24 lb/hr injectors.DarrenYeah, I was at ~92% duty cycle at 5k rpms, with a 12.6:1 AFR. Obviously, 30lb injectors are needed, and playing with the AFR a bit more to fine-tune it.The tune for new injectors takes seconds to add and write to the Quarterhorse. I just need to pull the intake and get them installed! I haven't done it yet due to Binary Editor licensing issues (I swap computers often, and Clint has more recently made it next to impossible to migrate to a new machine), but that is sorted as of Tuesday. Fixed my DFCO settings so the car doesn't try to stall out in the 33-40mph range. Higher stall converter makes lower-speed DFCO not possible without killing the engine.An interesting thing - I have 3.55's back in the car now, but can no longer break traction. Last week, with the 3.08's, from a roll at 15mph, flooring the pedal with the 3000 stall converter would break traction. Yesterday when it was not raining, I couldn't do the same thing. I don't get it. I need to get the wideband hooked back up and see what's going on. The computer probably learned something on the drives Monday/Tuesday for the gear swap, even without o2 sensors attached. Seems to be running lean now.Hope to get my new midpipe bolted up this weekend for both the better mandrel bends, and a non-broken cat (driver side rattles really loud), install new injectors, and see about returning these wires with evidence of poor insulation. I'd like to find a set that will never arc, even if running alongside bare metal. The Ford Racings ones aren't it, and the parts store wires seem to leak just as bad, with a stock ~20k Volt ignition system. I can only imagine what an aftermarket 50k + Volt coil would do through the wires... Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #20 – October 30, 2014, 01:08:48 PM Quote from: thunderjet302;439943What brand wires are those? Like I said I switched to MSD 8.5mm Super Conductor wires and have no more light show.How visible were your arcs before? I was going to look at the MSD wires - I assume they'd try to make them handle their higher voltage coils.The new wires I have were some factory-replacement things from Baxter Auto Parts. I figured maybe my Ford Racing wires were just bad so I'd try any set I could get my hands on. They are just as bad, so they will be going back to the store as "faulty". Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #21 – October 30, 2014, 02:45:39 PM Quote from: Seek;439945How visible were your arcs before? I was going to look at the MSD wires - I assume they'd try to make them handle their higher voltage coils.The new wires I have were some factory-replacement things from Baxter Auto Parts. I figured maybe my Ford Racing wires were just bad so I'd try any set I could get my hands on. They are just as bad, so they will be going back to the store as "faulty".The arcs with the FRPP wires were visible in a dark garage. I could see the spark at certain points along each wire. It was different with each wire but it was always at a point after a bend/curve in the wire. #3 was visible right above the plug boot. I couldn't see the spark the length of each wire like in your image (which is probably caused by the long exposure time) just at certain spots. After I swapped to the MSD wires I did the same test (dark garage at night). Nothing. No light show. I should note that all my wires are in the factory plastic looms so no wires touch bare metal. The FRPP wires were flashing without touching any metal engine parts. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #22 – October 30, 2014, 02:59:18 PM Actually, I will put in the new injectors tonight, return my new wires, pick up a new plug set, reinstall my old wires, and wait for some Firecore 50-series wires to ship. They seem to be loved by all, and around the same price as the MSD wires.I'm guessing since it took certain conditions to see the arcing, and only the camera can really pick it up, the arcing may be common-place. As long as they are routed well, the old wires should work fine for the time being.May also tackle the midpipe. The biggest question I have is whether I'll have clearance issues around the shifter linkage mount on the transmission. I also have a couple small bent areas on the end of the pipe from shipping damage - just need to hammer that back out. Picked up a BBK catted midpipe to get something with factory catback boltup locations. New lers and tail pipes are next. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #23 – October 30, 2014, 03:03:14 PM Some discussions on several of the Mustang boards praise the Ford Racing units with the occasional nay sayer. Several other brands pop up such as these:Firecore50http://www.uprproducts.com/mustang-ignition-wires-firecore50.html - P/N FIRE-PF2000 with a cost of $105.00Magnecorehttp://www.magnecor.com/magnecor1/files/catalog.pdf - P/N 80149 with a cost of $169.40AFShttp://www.andersonfordmotorsport.com/anderson-super-40-spark-plug-wires-purple-fits-86-93-5-0l-mustang/ - P/N AF-S40P with a cost of $175.00Taylorhttp://www.jegs.com/i/Taylor/895/84058/10002/-1?parentProductId=759354#moreDetails - P/N 895-84058 at a cost of $72.00MSDhttp://www.jegs.com/i/MSD/121/5541/10002/-1?CAWELAID=1710606270&CAGPSPN=pla&catargetid=230006180000848289&cadevice=c&gclid=CMTfrZ6I1cECFZaCaQodZSsA6Q - P/N 5541 at a cost of $42.00I think until you get into the $100+ range you are not going to see shiznit for difference.Darren Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #24 – October 30, 2014, 03:07:42 PM I used these MSD wires: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-31329/overview/make/ford/model/mustangThey are different than the street fire set. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #25 – October 30, 2014, 03:22:59 PM Quote from: thunderjet302;439955I used these MSD wires: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/msd-31329/overview/make/ford/model/mustangThey are different than the street fire set.Yeah, available with Prime shipping from Amazon, but I think my issue is less related to the wires, more related to that odd cylinder. The old iron heads had one odd cylinder also, so hopefully the new injectors smooth out idle. I will wait for the Firecores, then maybe try a stronger coil later just to see if they can still contain the additional voltage.Hopefully the "Ford Racing" injectors work better than the wires: http://www.americanmuscle.com/mustang-ev6-30-injectors.html Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #26 – October 30, 2014, 07:25:36 PM Did you see where they support up to 385 hp? Most people jump on it not realizing that is flywheel hp not rear wheel hp. My 24's were pegged out as I could not get past 290 rwhp with my old 306. All we did was install the 42's and it came up to 318 rwhp and the idle was much better as we did not have them pegged out.Darren Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #27 – October 30, 2014, 08:56:24 PM Quote from: Aerocoupe;439963Did you see where they support up to 385 hp? Most people jump on it not realizing that is flywheel hp not rear wheel hp. My 24's were pegged out as I could not get past 290 rwhp with my old 306. All we did was install the 42's and it came up to 318 rwhp and the idle was much better as we did not have them pegged out.DarrenIf you're talking to me, I know the limitations of the 24lbers. Ideally, they should be dropped once you start getting a little over 300hp. They can support more, but you lose the safety margin, and it depends on the AFR. Note that the EEC will command much richer mixtures on cold start, or cooler temperatures. Seeing what the injectors do immediately at 0-degrees ambient temperature, cold start, wot, is a good point to build from. Of course, I don't recommend going WOT on a cold motor/oil.It wasn't too much of an issue with the p-heads, big 12" converter, and whatnot, but it should be a major issue with the new parts and once I re-tune the transmission for 6k shift points, and review the datalogs. I wanted to put my 30lb injectors in before that point. Everything on my laptop is ready to get back into tuning though, so I have quite a bit of things I can accomplish over the next 3-days. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #28 – October 30, 2014, 10:01:51 PM I've had the pressure cranked up on my 24's to 48 PSI since I put them in years ago. THey're not enough for my combo at stock pressure. Ideally I should just cave in and step up to a larger size. Quote Selected
Time for some new ignition wires Reply #29 – October 30, 2014, 11:54:37 PM Quote from: V8Demon;439975I've had the pressure cranked up on my 24's to 48 PSI since I put them in years ago. THey're not enough for my combo at stock pressure. Ideally I should just cave in ans step up to a larger size.You know back when I had GT40P heads going from 19lb injectors to 24lb injectors was consistently worth 1mph at the track, which means I picked up 10rwhp from an injector swap. I had the car on a dyno at a local Mustang club dyno day and it made 237rwhp with GT40P heads, so about 300 at the flywheel. With the Edelbrock heads the car is consistently 5mph faster, which means the car picked up 40-50hp. I bet I'm past the 326hp 24lb injectors are good for at 85% duty cycle at 39psi. I've got no codes about adaptive fuel limit reached though so I've let the injectors alone. Quote Selected
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