Running really rich

Topic: Running really rich (Read 2716 times) previous topic - next topic

Running really rich

Reply #15 – February 16, 2006, 05:29:28 PM

yeah, I'm about to test all that. Picked up a vacuum/pressure tester so I'll now see whats doing what and whats not doing what it should.

Running really rich

Reply #16 – February 16, 2006, 06:24:07 PM

okay, here's the rundown on the passenger side of the engine bay, with all the vacuum hoses. The Air bypass seems to have air PRESSURE during warmup and then settles at 1in Hg vacuum. Air control valve is at 18in Hg vacuum all the time. Now a question about the EGR valve...it looks like its running to the little black box (EVR?) on the fender that has 2 hose inlets/outlets and an electrical plug. I don't want to follow the line and break more hoses so I'm curious if this is connect. Either way, on one hose, that thing is at 19in Hg vacuum +/- a couple during rpm changes. The other hose barb has no change whatsoever.

What this all means, I'm trying to figure out with manual in hand...but it isn't easy.

Running really rich

Reply #17 – February 16, 2006, 08:44:15 PM

That should be the reg valve for the EGR, IF there is no vac on the secondary side(to the EGR), its probably bad(vac portion). If it were electrically defective, you'd get a code... uhhh something...

Running really rich

Reply #18 – February 16, 2006, 09:20:22 PM

Quote

actually, later that day I went to smell the liquid and although it did smell faint of fuel, it seems to mostly be water. The odd thing though is that the car wasn't cold at all and I had just gotten back from a 40 minute drive...and the liquid came more rapidly as time went on. The car doesn't use coolant (with an exception of the washer fluid bottle always going empty on its own) and everything appears fine from the rear (black pipes though).

thats normal... its the catylic converters doing their j o b

Running really rich

Reply #19 – February 16, 2006, 10:23:57 PM

After messing with the air control/diverter valve, trying to figure out why it was only redirecting about 40% of the air, I found one of the internal seals broken in half and falling out. Going to grab a replacement tomorrow and get a new egr regulator valve since this one seems seized.

Either way, I don't think these are going to get my fuel economy back up to where it should be. I'm just about ready to go start throwing parts at it and replace the oxygen sensors.

Running really rich

Reply #20 – February 17, 2006, 07:42:53 PM

alright, replaced the air diverter/control valve. How much vacuum should the egr valve receive? It now gets 4in Hg max

Running really rich

Reply #21 – February 17, 2006, 08:36:35 PM

still throwing me codes 33, 44, and 94 although vacuum is good on both the diverter and bypass valves...and both function properly. Have the 4in of vacuum on the egr aswell. I tried swapping the vacuum lines on the TAB and TAD solenoids as well but it made no difference (in case they were in the wrong places). Running out of things to look for. Unless both check valves are bad, I don't see why both of these would still be failing

Running really rich

Reply #22 – February 17, 2006, 09:39:47 PM

A rich-running condition can cause 44/94 codes. The ECU looks for a lean condition while it puts air into the exhaust manifold. If it doesn't see any change, it can throw the code.

Have you probed the EGR wiring to see if the valve is outputting the EGR position correctly?

Running really rich

Reply #23 – February 17, 2006, 09:54:18 PM

What would I look for?

Either way, being a new part(s) (EGR valve and sensor), it "should" be functioning properly. Also, which of the solenoids should be active at idle? Air bypass is (shouldn't it be off?) while the diverter is not. Upon warmup, both are open. One other note, when both vacuum lines are live, the pump gets a bit noisy...should that be happening?

Oh, and a question, which of the diverter tubes go where? Can never keep the two straight.

edit:

Should be one when cold and one when warmed up, correct? According to that information, down would go to the cylinder heads (no vacuum) and to the rear would go to the cat (vacuum). Why does it have vacuum when first started?

edit:
nm, thinking about it, it seems it should only have vacuum at startup for going to the cylinder heads and go to the cat always after that point...under which cirspoogestances does the air bypass lose vacuum though? It always seems live.

Running really rich

Reply #24 – February 19, 2006, 07:00:10 PM

I can't figure out how to get to the oxygen sensors...plus the Haynes manual is of little help. Don't see how to remove the wiring, so using a socket isn't possible either. Please help

Running really rich

Reply #25 – February 19, 2006, 07:15:46 PM

Autohole rents a special socket to remove the O2 sensors.

Running really rich

Reply #26 – February 19, 2006, 07:29:04 PM

I tried pulling the wiring harness off the end of one of my new sensors, but it doesn't seem to budge. They should pull off, correct? (for use of the sockets). How am I supposed to get in there though? Exhaust manifold is in the way on the drivers side (unless using an open wrench) and I can't even find a way to get to the passenger side sensor.

Running really rich

Reply #27 – February 19, 2006, 07:48:07 PM

ok heres what ive come up with for this.... if there is any relays in the egr curcuite maybe that could have gone south on you? also you said the silinoids are new. could it be a defective one out of the box? i know ive never seen a egr valve or the other valves on the air system fail. but ive seen the vac lines go bad also the relays and silinoids. or the remote possibility that the eec could be bad but thats very remote. but check all those out and see where that may get you.

Running really rich

Reply #28 – February 19, 2006, 08:00:01 PM

Seek have you ever heard of a "crows foot"? Thats what the socket autohole rents looks like, the one they sell though is the long one with a slit in the side. Sounds like you need to rent the tool.

Running really rich

Reply #29 – February 19, 2006, 08:00:03 PM

The solenoids turn on and off properly, so I don't think they're the culprit. Either way, I'm looking at O2 sensors at this point for the rich mixture. I "know" they haven't been replaced in at least 35,000 miles (since I've had the car) so figured I'd start there. Can't seem to get them out though. The ones in there have a 7/8" area to wrench on and a smaller area near the wiring. The ones I got (one from autozone, one from partamerica) only have one place to wrench at, which is where it meets with the exhaust manifold (7/8"). How I'm supposed to get it out of there with the firewall and exhaust so close to the sensors, I haven't a clue. Everywhere I read says you shouldn't have to disconnect the exhaust to remove them, but I don't see how else. I'm close with a socketed open end wrench, but there's no room for movement.