Putting it all in perspective

Topic: Putting it all in perspective (Read 3323 times) previous topic - next topic

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #15 – February 07, 2006, 10:04:16 AM

Quote from: kyle2ooo

but seriously you need money for chicks

And you don't need those kind of chicks.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #16 – February 07, 2006, 10:44:52 AM

It is a part of Newfoundland history that people move away for work. They've moved to New York and Boston to build the sky spers, Ontario to work in the factories, and Alberta to work in the oil fields. Most of them long to be back home but the desire for money keeps them away.

A verse form the newfoundland song Salc00cher Joys

Quote

I was born down by the water, it's here I'm gonna stay
I've searched for all the reasons why I should go away
But I haven't got the thirst for all those modern day toys
So I'll just take my chances with those salc00cher joys.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #17 – February 07, 2006, 02:44:24 PM

Ok, not trying to step on any toes here, but I'll be the first to tell you that money is not "evil." Being rich and being happy are not mutually exclusive, despite what people may see in the movies or in some soap opera. I'd venture to say that a greater percentage of rich people are happier than poor people. It IS one of life's pleasures to pay off the credit card in full every month, own the house and land that you live on, and be able to pay for a car in full.

Not to say a person should sacrifice everything for their career. It's important to realize earning money is a means to an end. I'm thinking specifically of people like jcassity when I say this - I'm sure it was difficult for him to be shipped half way around the world from his family. However, he must have realized the benfits down the road would outweigh whatever challenges he has to face right now.

My parents both are near their 60s, and still work full time. Even if they were going to die the day after they retired and started receiving social security, I'm sure they would still continue working like they are doing now. They don't get pleasure out of buying a new car or a new tv or other material things, but they do find it worthwhile and fulfilling to be able to support me and my sister and live comfortably. Growing up, we never had cable tv, gaming systems, new computers or lots of the "fad" clothing. In that respect, I appreciate that we weren't rich back then, because I do enjoy the things I have right now (this past Christmas I couldn't think of anything that I wanted from my family). However, on the other hand, what we did receive were a safe neighborhood, braces, health insurance (which came in handy when I blew out my knee and had my wisdom teeth removed), college educations, etc. All these things require lots of money and a career, and I think are an important part of providing for your children if they so desire them.

Right now, my sister pulls in close to 200k a year. She'll be the first to tell you money is not a bad thing. Money is power, and power is the ability to determine your own destiny. She doesn't live paycheck to paycheck. She can go wherever she wants, whenever she wants and do whatever she wants at any time. Isn't that happiness as well? At the same time, I do agree with tbird85 that life's simple pleasures are still the best. Even today, neither of us has cable tv, because we always considered it an extravagent luxury. A good time for her is eating popcorn and watching a movie with her fiance. I think being modest is definitely important when it comes to money, no matter how much you have.

What it comes down to is stability. My mom is currently fighting cancer as well, and i've asked her if she regrets working everyday up until now. She tells me she's had no greater pleasure than watching me and my sister grown up, and being able to afford our education and being able to allow us to get on our own feet. Her career, and the family's income, will also enable us to handle this cancer as best as possible - without financial concern, or the fear that we'll be dependant on anyone but ourselves, or the insurance company will screw us. I think this is one of life's pleasures as well, even in this unfortunate time, that came about because of (yep, you guessed it) money. In addition, in this society where the elderly or not respected like they should be, who will take care of you when you can't work anymore or become ill? I respect my parents, and i'm sure they are very relieved that they covered all their bases and they won't feel like they are a burden upon their children.

I think it's borderline dangerous to be so idealistic in embracing the fisherman's logic. Yes, everyday pleasures are important, but working hard at something (even if it is only for money) at the cost of this "happiness" is not always a bad thing. I'm 24 right now, and will be in school (with negative income) for at least another 6 years. I spend about 8 hours in the library everyday, and of course this makes me very unhappy. I miss my friends and family. Should I just quit right now? No way. Even if I die when I'm 31, I still believe i'm making the most with what I have, right now. For me, living for the future is more fulfilling than living for the now, even if the future never comes.

If that fisherman had built his business empire, he wouldn't just return to the village and be the same person. His kids would get the medicine and education they might need, he could provide for his parents, and he would have brought back a sense of accomplishment. Worth the trade for a few years of missed "siestas"? I say hell yea, sign me up.

Sorry for the very, very long post. Maybe I should have had a siesta and a tequila instead, and made my reply with the minimum effort I could get away with. But what would have been the point of that ... ? :D

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #18 – February 07, 2006, 03:22:15 PM

Money itself may not be evil, but the City sure is. I'm running away from that, not cash. If I could take my job with me, I would in a heartbeat.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #19 – February 07, 2006, 04:46:06 PM

I kind of agree with what you are saying Andrew. Most of what you said, though, talks about money as a way to take care of yourself when you get older in case no one else can or wants to. Either that, or use it when you're working and have kids to be sure that they will be able to take care of themselves when they get older.

You said

Quote

Money is power, and power is the ability to determine your own destiny.

I disagree. I think freedom is power. If you rely on money to determine your destiny, then you are bound by money, a slave to it even. Happiness is not being able to go wherever you want or do whatever you want any time you want. Sure that's entertaining and enjoyable. But true happiness is being satisfied with who you are when everything else is taken away, including the money.

Money is not evil in and of itself. It is and end to a means.

The love of money is what is evil. When you will do anything to get more money and you associate your amount of money with your level of happiness. That is what is bad.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #20 – February 07, 2006, 04:56:15 PM

Quote from: 4thqtr

Money is power, and power is the ability to determine your own destiny.

Insanity at its finest, If you think Money is going to change your life you are correct. But I think what most people are tring to say is that money doesnt make you happy.............you, your family and your freinds make you happy regardless of you financial status. I think its great that some people can make 200k a year and live happily. Before you say that Money is power go to a homeless shelter just ask questions to people there. 80% will tell you they were very prosperous and fortunate until they got bored having everything they wanted and turned to the more exciting life.........and ultimately ruined their lives, yeah they changed their destiny.....................:hick:

Quote from: 4thqtr

For me, living for the future is more fulfilling than living for the now, even if the future never comes.

Sorry for the Edit.........Have Children I'm willing to bet this statement changes.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #21 – February 07, 2006, 05:00:46 PM

I understand what he trying to say, working hard and providing for yourself and yours can bring the happiness desired.
I don't live at home, I only see my wife on the weekends. I bust my butt everyday and don't make very much money. I am pretty happy, I like who I am, I love my wife more and more each day. But I can tell you right now, if you dropped a couple million on me, I could be much happier, I could see my wife everyday, ensure my children will never be hungry, and that they will be able to go to any college they can earn their way into. But that is why I work hard everyday, to reach that goal, part of being happy is the getting there, the working for it, the feeling that you ARE doing someting for you and yours, I will do my best never to miss any of my kids future lives (none yet wife still in school, man speaking of money...) but if i have to work a few overtime days to make sure they have no worries in their young lives and that they are provided for the best I can, I feel that is more inportant that sleeping in and napping in the middle of the day.

but I guess it is in what makes you happy, I want to make sure I can provide for my family, and feel like I have made a difference everyday, worked hard, and am being a good person. these things are important and what truely make me happy. though I would like to see my wife everyday, I can't imagine living a world away, at least i can go home on the weekends.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #22 – February 07, 2006, 05:59:06 PM

Hey, thanks for the reply Jim, I appreciate your thoughts and that you got through my whole, long spiel.

Quote from: jkirchman

If you rely on money to determine your destiny, then you are bound by money, a slave to it even.

Quote from: jkirchman

The love of money is what is evil. When you will do anything to get more money and you associate your amount of money with your level of happiness. That is what is bad.

I should clarify. Pursuing money for money's sake is obviously not the right way to go. I'm sure we're all appalled at how those Enron execs blew millions of dollars through their own greed and hedonism.

Quote from: jkirchman

I disagree. I think freedom is power.

Quote from: jkirchman

Most of what you said, though, talks about money as a way to take care of yourself when you get older in case no one else can or wants to. Either that, or use it when you're working and have kids to be sure that they will be able to take care of themselves when they get older.

I would argue that money, while not in direct correlation with freedom, does help the process along. How much better would life be if you had a healthy savings account earning you interest? If you had no mortgage or rent payment hanging over your head? If you weren't always pressured to pay back student loans and credit cards? In my opinion, debt, bills and credit ratings really hamper one's "freedom," even though it's not in the Constitutional sense of the meaning.

Not only does money make life better without these stresses, I feel there are more tangible freedoms involved. How cool would it be to actually have the financial freedom to go anywhere you wanted, see all your closest family and friends wherever they might be? Become your own boss by opening your own business? With money, this is all stuff that can be enjoyed now, not in the future or through your children. Doesn't the opening of more doors, the availibility of more options, qualify as "empowerment"? Isn't being able to spend more time with family and friends "happiness"?

Quote from: jkirchman

But true happiness is being satisfied with who you are when everything else is taken away, including the money.

I feel it's important to differentiate between being satisfied with yourself as a person, and being satisfied to your quality of life. I agree with you Jim, being satisfied with the person you are has nothing to do with money. However, as it pertains to tbirdscott's original story, I am arguing from the perspective of quality of life. I feel it's a mistake to sit back in an idle fashion and be satisfied because you are having a drink and spending time with friends and family, or you enjoy life's little pleasures. Personally, I feel that is too idealistic. Eventually, whether it's a material investment, debt or a family emergency, money is the answer. How else will you pay the hospital or get those Cougar/T-Bird parts you want?

Bottom line is this: If I pulled out 10,000 in cash and offered it to you with no strings attached, would you accept it? If you did accept it, why (weren't you satisfied with your life as it was)? And finally, how would you spend that money and how would it make you feel and why? It's not all about greed or the love of money itself. It's about what the money can enable you and your family to do - right now, AND in the future.

I'm arguing that pursuing this money/career, at the sacrifice of other pleasures in life, is sometimes the right thing to do because it will pay dividends down the road. I hope everyone remembers that this is only my own opinion, and that's why I personally disagree with the tbirdscott's story, even though I'm very glad he posted it to at least make me think about the fisherman's perspective.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #23 – February 07, 2006, 06:20:50 PM

T-bird85, thanks for your input.

Quote from: t-bird85

Insanity at its finest, If you think Money is going to change your life you are correct. But I think what most people are tring to say is that money doesnt make you happy.............you, your family and your freinds make you happy regardless of you financial status. I think its great that some people can make 200k a year and live happily. Before you say that Money is power go to a homeless shelter just ask questions to people there. 80% will tell you they were very prosperous and fortunate until they got bored having everything they wanted and turned to the more exciting life.........and ultimately ruined their lives, yeah they changed their destiny.............

It's interesting that you raised the BS flag and insinuated that I am insane. I want to know where you get your numbers. 80% of homeless people "were very prosperous and fortunate until they got bored having everything they wanted and turned to the more exciting life"? Please elaborate and cite your sources. I HAVE worked in homeless shelters, and was an EMT in Washington, DC for 3 years. I now live in Philadelphia and take classes in a hospital. I've met and treated lots of homeless people, but I must be that lucky one who met primarily the 20% that had mental problems and/or the disadvantaged upbringing, who lacked the ability to ever be "prosperous" or "fortunate" or "bored of having everything." I suppose 80% are vets too?

What I'm saying is that yes, family and friends are very important to happiness. However, I do believe that money does make life better and more happy. Call me insane, call me greedy, call 80% of the homeless population ex-millionaires, but that is my opinion only.

Quote from: t-bird85

Have Children I'm willing to bet this statement changes.

No thanks! :D But I'll let you know one day (waaaayyyy down the road) if my children change my opinion.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #24 – February 07, 2006, 08:40:10 PM

Quote from: oldraven

Money itself may not be evil, but the City sure is. I'm running away from that, not cash. If I could take my job with me, I would in a heartbeat.

I agree 100% - even a city as small as Halifax (and the even smaller suburban town of Sackville that I live in) is just too loud, busy, fast, and uncaring for me. I lived 30 of my 34 years in Sackville and am now looking at moving the hell out because I'm tired of the traffic, noise and general hassle of doing even everyday things around town. The population of Sackville went from less than a thousand in the 60s to about 10,000 in the 70's to 25,000 in the 80's and 90's to over 60,000 now. People used to move from Halifax to Sackville to get away from the city - problem is they gradually brought the city with them. Halifax used to have a reputation for friendly people and courteous drivers, but now it's as bad as any other city. Hell, when a light turns green you have to wait for four or five cars going the other way to run their red light before you dare to enter an intersection, and if you want to get out into traffic don't wait for somebody to let you in, you'll grow old. Now you simply force your way in, cut somebody off, and answer their horn with your finger.

My very short visit to Montreal this past fall cemented my distaste for city life - Halifax was mild compared to that. But it's still bad.

The house I'll be looking at tomorrow is in the small town of Upper Kennetcook - a town of about 500 people. No more traffic, no more fart cans, no traffic lights... just peace, quiet, and blackflies... and when I want to go to the city it's only 45 minutes away

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #25 – February 07, 2006, 11:24:30 PM

Drugs need i say more..............

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #26 – February 08, 2006, 12:04:18 AM

I'm not even going to jump into this thread.
I guess I did

I believe that I would be happier if I had money, and alot of it. I lost a relationship because the girl (who I'm madly in love with) didn't see me as a supporting individual.... Need I say more?

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #27 – February 08, 2006, 01:07:50 AM

Quote from: CougarSE

I'm not even going to jump into this thread.
I guess I did

I believe that I would be happier if I had money, and alot of it. I lost a relationship because the girl (who I'm madly in love with) didn't see me as a supporting individual.... Need I say more?

see you do need money to get chicks
told ya
:flip:
:giggle:

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #28 – February 08, 2006, 01:53:40 AM

Claude, if she based the strength of your relationship on your ability to pay for shiznit, she's not the type of partner for a good meaningful relationship anyway.

On this subject of money, I remember hearing that a substantial percentage, more than half, I think (not sure on the figures, I may research it more) of people who've won large lottery jackpots end thier lives in debt and bankruptcy.

Here is a story about such fortune to misfortune. After reading that, uhh, yeah, I think I'll start saving some money.

Putting it all in perspective

Reply #29 – February 08, 2006, 10:17:13 AM

Quote from: Thunder Chicken

No more traffic, no more fart cans, no traffic lights... just peace, quiet, and blackflies...

That's like poetry, man.