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Topic: 25,550 miles thunderbird (Read 3632 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #15
Quote from: EricCoolCats


That actually would explain the rust on the first one though. ;)


And the original owner's age would explain the couple ses here and there...... :giggle:
Long live the 4-eyes!  - '83 Tbird Turbo - '85 Marquis LTS - '86 LTD Wagon-  '81 Granada GL 2dr

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #16
still both pretty clean cars. though man, that first one has NOTHING on it. i kinda like all the electric do dads.. too bad its not a 4 eye.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #17
The first T-bird reminds me a LOT of my old '84 Cougar.  Those are the only two cars I've seen with passenger mirror deletes.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #18
Quote
Actually a couple months ago there was a white '88 TC that was on Ebay...had all of 23,000 miles on it.....it was all original except for the battery and was flawless....it looked like a brand new car inside and out. Guy had all the paperwork for it too including the window sticker. I actually got a little satisfaction out of that one when it ended. Why? I've gotten lots of heat  either through retarded posts, bashing PMs and e-mails from members of the NATO board who piss and moan about how I modded my TC...especially the engine swap. They loathe guys like me for "murdering" a TC (their words) and how I should have my ass kicked (yeah...some idiot said that to me). A majoity of them seem to have this collective pipe dream that these cars are gonna be collector items and fetch good money so guys like me who own TC's should all leave the cars be and not mod them (which I find odd because if you truly believe your stock TC is gonna be worth bucks, you should encourage me to "wreck" my car....in theory making yours worth more!). A lot them on the board expected the TC I mentioned to fetch some good money. In the end it fetched a little over $7,500....hardly big bucks, especially considering the condition of the car and mileage.


i think its rediculous, ignorant, and a shame. there will always be purists no matter what your doing but take in to consideration the turbo coupe was a production vehicle, built in relitivally high production numbers. they may be dying out but they are not all THAT rare. as far as swapping a V8 into one, i see it as an improvement in some ways althought i think both the 5.0 HO and the 2.3 are 2 of a handfull of fords best ever engines.

 your car was a pretty well wrecked turbo coupe before it ever saw a V8 if im not mistaken. the turbo coupe guys should be happy you salvaged and saved it instead of destroying it. Honestly, i truely belive its a number of the "purists" that are basically jelous. forget the SCV8 you have, you car is one of the most cleanest and tastfully done up tbirds out there. i can only think of a handfull that come close at all.

how come you cant find guys crying about others that swap out that 3.8 in favor for a V8? where are these guys when that haapnes? further more, if they were purists to that form than why are they changing/modding there cars as well? i just dont see why its such a big deal to them. why cant they just take pride in their cars and respect and enjoy what others are doing. ive seen plenty of stuff on other peoples cars that i dont agree with but its not my car...

I wonder what the purists are gonna have to say to Chuck when he does his swap... :rollin:
:america: 1988 Thunderbird Sport, Former 4.6 DOHC T56 conversion project.

Rest of the country, Welcome to Massachusettes. Enjoy your stay.

 
Halfbreed... Mango Orange Y2K Mustang GT
FRPP complete 2000 Cobra engine swap, T56 n' junk...
~John~

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #19
Quote from: shame302


I wonder what the purists are gonna have to say to Chuck when he does his swap... :rollin:


The thing is....the Tbird is not a TC....it's a look-alike.  It was an old plain-Jane 5.0/AOD car  ;)

Now the '84 XR-7 on the other hand....will NOT be getting a 2.3T put back into it  :rollin:
Long live the 4-eyes!  - '83 Tbird Turbo - '85 Marquis LTS - '86 LTD Wagon-  '81 Granada GL 2dr

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #20
Quote from: shame302
i think its rediculous, ignorant, and a shame. there will always be purists no matter what your doing but take in to consideration the turbo coupe was a production vehicle, built in relitivally high production numbers. they may be dying out but they are not all THAT rare. as far as swapping a V8 into one, i see it as an improvement in some ways althought i think both the 5.0 HO and the 2.3 are 2 of a handfull of fords best ever engines.

 your car was a pretty well wrecked turbo coupe before it ever saw a V8 if im not mistaken. the turbo coupe guys should be happy you salvaged and saved it instead of destroying it. Honestly, i truely belive its a number of the "purists" that are basically jelous. forget the SCV* you have, you car is one of the most cleanest and tastfully done up tbirds out there. i can only think of a handfull that come close at all.

how come you cant find guys crying about others that swap out that 3.8 in favor  for a V8? you never hear that. further more, if they were purists to that form than why are they changing/modding there cars as well? i just dont see why its such a big deal to them. why cant they just take pride in their cars and respect and enjoy what others are doing. ive seen plenty of stuff on other peoples cars that i dont agree with but its not my car...

I wonder what the purists are gonna have to say to Chuck when he does his swap... :rollin:


 Personally I've got nothing against the purists at all....all I ask is respect me for what I do since it is MY car. I don't go around telling TC guys to "dump that sucky 2.3 with a hairdryer on it for a real motor" .....it's their car....do what they like. I got plenty of respect for guys that mod the 2.3 and make V8 power and salute them for doing so but when these guys start flaming me for "taking the easy way out" ( yeah...swapping an EEC controlled 5.0 into a TC is "EASY"...NOT!!!!) and wrecking my car is just plain ignorant. I lived with the 2.3 for a long time (12 years)...it just didn't do it for me anymore and the aftermarket for that motor is virtually non-existant nowadays.

 Bottom line is I built it for me and I'm happy as hell with it and if the feedback I get from car shows, cruise nights and fellow T-Bird and Ford enthusiasts is any indication, overwhelmingly more people love what I've done to it than despise it.

Quote from: TurboCoupe50

Eventually the really nice original TC will be somewhat collectable, but thats probably another 10 years down the road


 I think they have some potential to be a collectible but I think the market will be tiny as it's a small group of people who dig these cars....tiny markets generally keep the value low. Looking at cars that get the money today is stuff that was popular back in it's heyday and the T-Bird TC will never be considered a hot sales item by Ford...in fact it was considered a failure.....people weren't and still aren't into the whole small engine/turbo thing...especially in a big car. Most people I used to hear commenting on the T-Bird TC's all in general loved the looks and packaging but hated the 2.3 turbo motor...."if only Ford put a V8 in it" was all too common a statement about the car.

 A good example is the SVO Mustang (another sales failure from Ford's perspective) All the purists figured it would be the Mustang collectible of the 80's due to low production numbers and 20 years later they don't get money at all....most V8 GT's and LX's in similiar condition still fetch more money with ease.

 Frankly, the whole concept of holding off on what you do to a car because of how it will affect it's potential future value is retarded IMO. These guys who claim to love the thing so  much who cares about that stuff? Drive it, mod it, whatever.....just enjoy the  thing. I myself could care less because I'll never sell my TC....the only potential future owner that will ever get the keys to my Bird will be my son.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #21
agreed 100%

i honestly think the only ones that will have any real value at all will be the ones with no mile and stored its whole life in new condition and kept a virgin. im sure there are a few out there and thats what will make them valuable 10-20 more years down the road. the fact that its in original condition with no miles and there just arent any left around otherwise. its certainly not gonna be these daily or weekend driven/raced around modded turbo coups ect.

take the tbird in the auction. rare, low miles etc...i know i wouldnt give someone much more for it than i would any other tbird or cougar in stock condition. im sure there arent too many other guys that would.

look at erics car. its practically a one off but its not going to have any serious value to a collector because its not original. he built it for himself and i think thats the only reason to build a car...to enjoy.
:america: 1988 Thunderbird Sport, Former 4.6 DOHC T56 conversion project.

Rest of the country, Welcome to Massachusettes. Enjoy your stay.

 
Halfbreed... Mango Orange Y2K Mustang GT
FRPP complete 2000 Cobra engine swap, T56 n' junk...
~John~

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #22
Quote from: shame302
look at erics car. its practically a one off but its not going to have any serious value to a collector because its not original. he built it for himself and i think thats the only reason to build a car...to enjoy.


Actually...I just had it appraised this past May and it has quite a bit of value. Attemting to disassociate myself with my own car and looking objectively, I can say with certainty that it is probably the most valuable Fox-chassis Cougar in existence, in America at least. I've never heard of another Fox Cougar that's worth more, anyway. However, when you look at Glenn (Hawk's) car, it has just as much done to it, if not more. His was wrecked beyond belief in the first place too, so that's a testimony to the craftsmanship behind it. It's certainly just as valuable IMO. The two cars are valuable for different reasons but they're still the only ones like themselves.

Value is a perception that is influenced by many factors. We can sit here and second-guess values all day but that doesn't mean it's accurate. Actual real-world value can only be determined by appraisers and automotive experts. And in the long run (as in, future worth) that's what's going to help our body style. So long as we can perpetuate the species we'll be fine.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #23
eric, you don't count. your car is so far beyond a stock cougar.. it's like saying some of those super modded '34 fords are still a '34 ford sedan. Your's is awesome, I can't believe a cougar would ever be that amazing as a show car, but it is hard to compare that to a 500$ car from some grandma, at least untill you sink in 30 times what you paid into it... :P

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #24
Value is not an issue with me anyway. I do not intend to sell my car, ever. It is paid for and lien free, and will remain that way, so debt will never force me to sell it.

For this reason I will dive into the car with reckless abandon when it comes to modifying it. When I installed the overhead console, for example, I took my utility knife and cut into the headliner will no regrets. I happlily hacked the consolette off the front seat when I installed a full console.  I gleefully restored and installed the ten-hole rims knowing full well that no 87-88 T-Bird ever sported 'em. And when I do finally do the T5/HO upgrade I will do so without a care in the world. Now I'm not saying that I will do just about anything to my car - I would never do anything to destroy its essence, but I'm certainly not concerned about destroying its value by adding 75 horsepower, a stickshift, and a TC REAR. And if I could find a Mark VIII or SC for parts I wouldn't think twice about a DOHC or SCV6 swap.

It is, after all, my ed car and I will do with it what I like.

That being said, I really don't see these cars appreciating in value all that much. They will increase slightly, but never as much as, say, a Monte Carlo SS or Hurst/Olds 442. Our cars were not really desirable to most people in the 80's, they were less so in the 90's, and even less so in the 2000's. I can't see them suddenly becoming more desirable in the future. If you don't believe me, try selling your car for what YOU think it's worth. I guarantee that unless another T-Bird/Cougar enthusiast stumbles across it you won't get your asking price. The general public just doesn't have much appetite for a 150-horsepower, 3800 pound mushmobile. They don't see these cars like we do.
2015 Mustang GT Premium - 5.0, 6-speed, Guard Green - too much awesome for one car

1988 5.0 Thunderbird :birdsmily: SOLD SEPT 11 2010: TC front clip/hood ♣ Body & paint completed Oct 2007 ♣ 3.55 TC rear end and front brakes ♣ TC interior ♣ CHE rear control arms (adjustable lowers) ♣ 2001 Bullitt springs ♣ Energy suspension poly busings ♣ Kenne Brown subframe connectors ♣ CWE engine mounts ♣ Thundercat sequential turn signals ♣ Explorer overhead console (temp/compass display) ♣ 2.25" off-road dual exhaust ♣ T-5 transmission swap completed Jan 2009 ♣

 

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #25
i guess what i meant was...typically its the all original, untouched cars that go for huge amounts of money. if you had say an original untouched boss 302 compared to say a regular fastback done over to emulate one. or take the original boss and say someone did all kinds of silly mods...? wouldnt that hurt the value?

its easy to see the money, craftsmanship and time that went into both of your cars. i dunno, maybe you could sell them for what you have into them. they certianly are very unique cars. i think typically though, as specially in the mustang comunity you cant expect that. how many times do you see fox mustangs with 20k plus into them sell for under 10? like you said, its hard to guess value. you could add up reciepts and say you have so much into it but its worth only what someone is willing to pay for it. ive seen it go the other way too. ive seen some rather un remarkable cars sell for remarkable sums of money...anyway, i think i kind of went off on a tangent all together. all i meant to get at was, screw the purists. its too bad for them if they are so narrow minded about that stuff.
:america: 1988 Thunderbird Sport, Former 4.6 DOHC T56 conversion project.

Rest of the country, Welcome to Massachusettes. Enjoy your stay.

 
Halfbreed... Mango Orange Y2K Mustang GT
FRPP complete 2000 Cobra engine swap, T56 n' junk...
~John~

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #26
Quote from: Funky Cricket
it is hard to compare that to a 500$ car from some grandma, at least untill you sink in 30 times what you paid into it... :P


30 times?! Keep going.... ;)

I have always been a huge proponent of modding a Cougar or T-Bird to your heart's desire, and I always will be. There was nothing wrong with stock. But there was some unacknowledged option that came with these cars, the option that gets the modding idea into your head, and after that it's all over. And you can see from the replies, from the photos posted, from all the comments, and from the general consensus, that everyone seems to have had this same option. :)

I like my cars modded. But I really, really enjoy seeing a stock one at shows. This past July I went to the CCOA Nats East in VA. The 1983-88 Stock class had 3 of the most gorgeous, detailed, clean and original Cougars I have ever seen in my life (and remember, I sat in Cougars on the showroom floor when they were new). It was so cool, in fact, that the three owners and I sat across from our cars in the shade, and giggled our asses off as we watched everyone voting (People's Choice) just scramble between the cars, trying to figure out which one was the "best". In the end, did it matter? For trophies, sure, but for the propogation of the species it was even more important. This was a national Cougar show, put on by other goofy Cougar owners. Our class was recognized as THE toughest class to judge that day. The other classes included all the early cars, the XR7's, the XR7-G's, the convertibles, the Eliminators, and the Boss cars, not to mention all the other customs.

Now, what do you think stuck out in everyone else's minds? The fact that we had 3 cars show up, or that we had 3 of the cleanest cars at the entire event show up? We put a perception in the minds of others that not only are our cars worthy of celebration, but that we can hang with--and beat--the best of the crowd. And that is something about which I'm most proud. We changed minds and perceptions that day. That is much more valuable than any trophy.

The difference is, from the general public's point of view, these cars weren't great performers in stock condition. And to a certain extent they are right. However, if they take the time to compare our cars against virtually any other car from the 1980's, they should be able to see the difference. They hold up extraordinarily well. They have a great track record, aspirit, and a soul. What they didn't have was a blistering performance model from the factory. Performance (XR7, Turbo Coupe), yes--blistering, no. And that's what people seem to want now. Hell, leave it to Ford to put 14" hubcaps on a V8 rear-drive car, then water down the power output! Fact is, one way or another, if you want these cars to be faster or better you're going to have to modify something. And some people just don't want to do that. These are some of the only cars I've ever seen that can be anything to anyone. We recognize this and tolerate it. It's up to us, though, to change perceptions. And those perceptions will directly relate to value. Everything affects everything, all is one, it is all a big circle.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #27
i was trying to be nice about the amount of money in that car of yours :P it is prolly much much higher.. but, man it is one hot car. (just needs to be faster now!! heheh)

just so sad that I don't have a 'bird to tear apart anymore.. *sigh* soon...

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #28
Quote from: EricCoolCats
We put a perception in the minds of others that not only are our cars worthy of celebration, but that we can hang with--and beat--the best of the crowd.

And isnt that why we do what we do? I roll around on friday and saturday nights flaunting my car, reving and parking with people. Why do I do it? Because my dick feels bigger? well...maybe...but no. I do it to say "hey look, i have a thunderbird, and its worth something, it can be as fast if not faster than you, its cleaner than your car, and my car is worth something."

I dont want to take my car to shows to fish for compliments, win trophys, get a kiss on the cheek, and all the other  associated with car shows, i want to go out there, get the "check it out, a thunderbird" kinda looks, and make people realize that its not a beater, its not "just an old car", that its not some old luxury car they had back when they had kids and needed something bigger but didnt want a 4 door. I want them to see the effort and pride i put into this car that theyd normally overlook.

Thats what its all about for me, not the money, not the awards, the praise, but its all about the car, and the feeling i get from doing what i do, and seeing someone look at it from the outside. Positive or negative attention, the impression was left in the persons mind, and thats all that counts.
It's Gumby's fault.

Re: 25,550 miles thunderbird

Reply #29
That's it, its for the fun of it and I enjoy the attention the car gets.
 I've recieved tons of compliments on it. I've gotton complimented from when I was at a show, putting gas in it, and from my aunts neighbors. I've also recieved negative comments that 90% of the time are at car shows. Classic car guys just don't appreciate them.
There's also that wow factor. Just to see someone do a double take when I go roaring by in a personal luxury car that is supposed to be quiet and smooth. There is a feeling I get when I'm cruising in the Cougar that's unlike anything else. As indescribable as it is, it's there and it's great.

Most people don't see these as performance cars but as that slow v-6(sorry 3.8 owners), dented and rusted beater they picked up from some old woman or man for $500. They see tham as basic transportation only, nothing special.

We may have to modify our cars to be strong performers but nearly everyone else does too,.When you hit the local cruise-in, you don't see many if any cars that are factory stock. So who are they to judge us that our cars weren't as good performance wise as they should have been from the factory. Eric hit the nail on the head. Our cars are worthy of celebration and can hang with--and beat--the best of the crowd. My car is by no means the fastest nor the cleanest. It has it's flaws but I consider it a hell of a lot better than every run of the mill first generation Camaro I see with a 350 because it's different and unexpected.

Think about what we're all doing. Were helping revive a time in the 80's when there was a renaissance in the auto industry. The first effort towards performance after the 70's gas crunch. With heavy emissions controls and striving to produce safer, more economical cars, these are part of what the U.S automakers produced. A fight against the foreign auto makers and a style unlike anything seen before.
I'm glad to be a part of it.