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Topic: Car will then won't start..... (Read 6301 times) previous topic - next topic

Car will then won't start.....

Last Friday, a BRAND NEW problem started......

I went out to start the car, and it tries to turn over, plenty of power, but no start. I thought it was the TFI. I swapped it, and the car started up. Saturday morning, no start. it tried but wouldn't start. I saw the fuel pressure gauge, no pressure. I thought the relay was probably going out. I took it to Autozone, and he said it was bad.

I ordered another relay, the one he got in for me tested bad. ordered another, waited two days, then went to get it, ......they didn't finish the order. SO, went to Napa yesterday and had them order one....they got it today. Wrong part. I ran to the local boneyard and grabbed one from the only '87/'88 Bird around for miles. The relay looks brand new (it was a low mile car), but looks aren't everything. I swapped it in a little while ago after work. car started right up. I let it run for about 15 minutes, then turned the car off. Tried to start it, and again, engine turning over, but no start. No fuel pressure at the gauge again.

I JUST let the car sit for about ten minutes, JUST ran out and tried to start it....it DID start. I turned it off, then no start again.

Fuel pump? Relay? what the ?

I, thinking it was a different issue at first, tried my spare distributor, spare ignition switch, swapped the pump hanger, new TFI module (Motorcraft), then a used relay (yeah, could be , hopefully the new one will be here tomorrow)....I can't help but think fuel pump relay or pump. If I can get a relay, and that doesn't fix it, I guess I can order a new pump.

Open to all thoughts on this.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #1 –
The eec triggers the relay for the fuel pump. If your getting no fuel pump, next you need to see if your getting spark when its happening.

If i had to just guess at what it could be, id guess either eec relay could be ping out, or a bad ground to the eec.

Next time this happens, jump the fuel pump through the sti connector and see if it pumps fuel or not.
Quote from: jcassity
I honestly dont think you could exceed the cost of a new car buy installing new *stock* parts everywhere in your coug our tbird. Its just plain impossible. You could revamp the entire drivetrain/engine/suspenstion and still come out ahead.
Hooligans! 
1988 Crown Vic wagon. 120K California car. Wifes grocery getter. (junked)
1987 Ford Thunderbird LX. 5.0. s.o., sn-95 t-5 and an f-150 clutch. Driven daily and going strong.
1986 cougar.
lilsammywasapunkrocker@yahoo.com

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #2 –
What do you mean by "jump the fuel pump through the STI connector"? Remember, I am NOT an electrical guy. Never have been, never will be.

When this problem happens, there is no fuel pressure, the fuel pressure gauge is zero.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #3 –
could there possibly be a short in one of the TFI wires?
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5.0 HO 306 roller block, machined GT-40P heads, Wiseco dished forged pistons, Eagle forged floating I-beam connecting rods, Lunati pushrods, ARP bolts, Scorpion aluminum 1.6 rockers, Comp Cams Magnum 266HR, Explorer intake, 65mm TB, MAF Conversion, 19# injectors, Ford Racing stainless P-headers, 2-1/2" cat-less exhaust w/ Flowtech Afterburner lers , SC AOD with 2800 BDR torque converter, 3.73 T-Lok rear, CHE rear control arms, full 2-1/2" frame w/1" jacking rails & seat supports, Rear disk brakes, Turbine wheels, All original interior w/ floor shift upgrade .......
Pretty much every panel on my 87 is new, rebuilt, or re constructed. :D
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Car will then won't start.....

Reply #4 –
I'll go see what I can see.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #5 –
Jump the fuel pump pin to ground, if pump runs the FP relay isn't your problem...

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #6 –
Tom, does the key need to be on? Also, I guess s I need to see if the car starts. If so, then I'd have to wait til it dies to try this test. Doesn't that sound right?
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..
 

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #7 –
Quote from: vinnietbird;449242
Tom, does the key need to be on? Also, I guess s I need to see if the car starts. If so, then I'd have to wait til it dies to try this test. Doesn't that sound right?

Yes ign must be on...  If pump were to run only when jumper is in place, that points to a control issue from ECM.. I'll need to double check but possibly a intermittent connection in the inertia switch would prevent pump from activating with jumper in place...

EDIT

Yeah if either ECM relay or inertia switch is intermittent, fuel pump won't activate even with jumper in place... If ECM relay is intermittent the check engine light won't be on as it also powers 'puter...

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #8 –
Tom, in the spot you show in the picture where the fuel pump wire should be in the test plug, there is no wire. It is probably in another slot. What color is it?
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #9 –
I have no check engine light, either.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #10 –
On another note,

It just started, I turned it back off, then no start. If I check the plug for power at the fuel pump hanger, could that point towards a fuel pump issue? On the voltmeter, where should I set it, and which wire is ground to the fuel pump plug? There's a pink wire and an orange wire.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #11 –
I hate to ask stupid questions, but it is NO secret that electrical stuff kills me.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #12 –
The F/P wire in test plug should be tan with a green stripe...

BUT assuming you normally have a check engine light with ign on, that needs to be checked out first... No CEL generally means the ECM isn't getting power, that usually means ECM relay which also powers fuel pump relay...

ECM relay is above right kick panel, at approx height of upper door hinge...

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #13 –
I have a check engine light until the engine starts. Sorry about that, I meant no check engine light while the motor is running. I may run and grab that relay for the ECM just in case as well. First, let me go see if the pump runs.....
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..

Car will then won't start.....

Reply #14 –
I put a spade clip to the tan wire, long wire to the trunk, and grounded it. I can't hear the pump at all. Possibly a bad pump? Relay? ECM relay? I do have a check engine light with the key in the run position.
'88 Sport--T-5,MGW shifter,Trick Flow R intake,Ed Curtis cam,Trick Flow heads,Scorpion rockers,75mm Accufab t-body,3G,mini starter,Taurus fan,BBK long tube headers,O/R H-Pipe, Flowamaster Super 44's, deep and deeper Cobra R wheels, Mass Air and 24's,8.8 with 3.73's,140 mph speedo,Mach 1 chin spoiler,SN-95 springs,CHE control arms,aluminum drive shaft and a lot more..