Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* October 07, 2012, 08:33:48 PM 1.8L kia sophia 4cylcar over heated on monther in lawCar has had some brown looking in the radiator fluid.No coolant found on the dip stick.Car runs fine, quite as a sewing machine.found several holes / leak in radiatororder up and installed new radiator and Tstattook out and cleaned off temp sender and temp sensorflushed out heater coreran car heater core supply line off, coolant dumps out so thats good.ran car with heater core return line off and coolant dumps out of other end of core so thats good.ran car with all hoses on and began my verification problem was solved.tested car today and it was like hell getting all the air out but finally heat arrived at the heater core.Let car idle for several minutes with / without heat on and guages were normal.Took car for drive and car will over heat inside of a mile if i trust my guages.Fan comes on just at or barely above middle range of guage.Fan runs constant once here and needle will climb up.I am stumped by the brown stuff that was in the coolant and am pondering a cracked head or bad water pump.water seems to circulate fine, is it possible to have a bad water pump but yet not have any coolant leaking past the weap hole/ isnt the shaft of the water pump physically welded to the impeller or is there a termal disonnect somewhere on the shaft. Is it possible to have a bad water pump that does not leak yet also does supply coolant?If the head is cracked, do i need to buy a coolant system check kit and put aire on the system ?stumped here.not loosing any coolant, and the car runs fine yet it pysically seems to be over heating. TSTAT was original 0EM 85DEGC / 88DEGC and i replaced with a 190deg tstat, this seems ok to me.should i go with a lower deg Tstat or do you all think i need to let a shop diagnose what the issue is here, its my mother in laws only car. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #1 – October 07, 2012, 09:50:49 PM It's certainly possible for the water pump to shiznit the bed without leaking, in fact Volkswagen 1.8 and 2.0 engines are notorious for it. They have a plastic impeller that comes apart, and the car overheats with no leaks. It quite often only comes partially apart and still circulates the coolant enough to prevent overheating, and you don't even know there's a problem until you do the timing belt and water pump. However, you said the water seems to be circulating, so this likely isn't the problem. Also, if you can see coolant circulating in the radiator it isn't likely a thermostat issue. This is easy enough to check though - get the engine hot (hot enough that the fan comes on without the A/C on - this also means not in defrost mode), and feel the upper rad hose. If it's hot the thermostat is opening, if it isn't, the thermostat may be stuck shut. You can also tell by feeling the air the fan is pulling through the rad - if it's warm hot coolant is entering the rad. If it's cool the rad is not getting any hot coolant from the engine.There's also a chance the gauge is lying to you. If the car has separate sensors for the gauge and computer you can check this with a scan tool - just observe the engine coolant temperature on the tool and compare it with the gauge. This will only work if it has separate sensors though. An infrared temp gun can help too, just point the gun at the upper rad hose outlet and watch the temp. If it never gets hot the t-stat is stuck. If it gets hot but stays within a normal range the gauge is lying. If it gets hot and keeps climbing you'll need to dig deeper...One must not forget the basics, too. If the car has A/C and the condenser is plugged up with road grime there might not be enough air getting through the rad. I had this happen on a customer's 2010 F-150 that was a farm truck - it was overheating, and the condenser was plugged up solid with hay dust. After blowing the dust away the truck ran fine... Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #2 – October 07, 2012, 10:34:50 PM thanks, you gave me a few things to look at.whats your thoughts on my seeing brown milk shake goop in the radiator fluid?its like oil getting in there i suppose.I will check the condensor for debrisI do like your point about the plastic impeller, ill now put my money on that.upper hose does get hot, air coming off fan does feel warm, i dont think the two sensors i have are telling lies, i could replace them both though if i want. I dont have a scan tool but i do have a laser thermometer that i didnt think of using till you mentioned it.thanks again, post back, gotta have this fixed for her in the next couple days.in my origina post, i failed to mention something i noticed. When the heater core hoses were off, i was kind of amazed at how slow the water was actually flowing. it didnt shoot out like i expected the coolant to do. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #3 – October 07, 2012, 10:40:56 PM I'd have to think that the brown goo might be corrosion. Could the water pump be clogged to some degree as to restrict the flow?I think this because you said there wasn't a lot of flow from the heater hoses, might it be that one of the radiator hoses is clogged or pinching itself off? Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #4 – October 07, 2012, 10:55:16 PM could be, nother good point,, which means ill have to figure out how to get at the water pump,, good thing i have a brand new timing belt as well.I'll prob shot gun the water pump and replace it.Already got the rad & tstat new and in, what the hell, might as well keep on with a new water pump.who knows, maybe the engine will blow up next and Ill see it on a roll back with 400 bux in new parts going to the bone yard...LOL... that would make perfect sense. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #5 – October 08, 2012, 10:25:25 AM i yet again failed to mention something else...........after i thought i had all the air out of the system, and car was still over heating by way of visual on guage, i removed the coolant temp sensor to clean it. i figured the brown goop may be coating the probe causing a delay in when the eFan gets signal to come on.so yesterday evening, one of the last things i did was remove both the sender and sensor.I noticed that when i removed the sensor that triggers the fan, no water came out. This is even after i was for certain i had all the air out.so i take off the radiator cap , pinch off the radiator over flow hose, i blow as hard is i can into the radiator and out spews coolant out the hole the sensor was mounted.keep in mind when i removed the sensor, no coolant came out.It may be possible that i have air still in the system???????????? this would put the sensor in hot air only which would trigger over heating.anyone know of a way to get all air out?since the heater core is higher than everything else cooling, could i remove one hose and blow into it or add air to push water around in the system........since its bypassing the Tstat?? Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #6 – October 08, 2012, 01:41:47 PM Take a hose, hold it in your radiator with a rag (for pressure) and make sure you flush out your cooling system real well. Run just water for a day or two with/without A/C on, heater on/off and flush it out again. I let the car do the work for me. I open the spout on the bottom of my radiator to drain. What usually happens is if there is still in your system it will mix up like a milk shake. I flush it until it is clear, then add coolant. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #7 – October 09, 2012, 10:43:14 AM purchased water pump, yet to install.so last night i was troubleshooting some more to insure all air is out of system.I was squeezing the lower radiator hose and i felt what seemed to be random "THUMPING" in the hose. thats the only way i know to describe it.when i pinch off the lower hose, i dont feel the turbulance of the water like i think it aught to be with the tstat open. Also, the oem pump has a metal impeller, thats bad news for Tchickens theory, the replacement is BRAND NEW oem as well with a metal impeller.defective rad , old tstat were replaced. compression numbers are 185, 185, 188, 186 on cold motor.what could the thumping be ? Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #8 – October 09, 2012, 03:27:32 PM I think you're starting to chase your tail. Check for debris and/or obstruction between the condenser and the radiator, and use a block tester to check for combustion gas in the coolant. What you're describing sounds suspiciously like a blown head gasket, but remember that all blown head gaskets are not created equal, there's a dozen (or better) ways for one to blow: oil to coolant, coolant to oil, oil to combustion, combustion to oil, coolant to combustion, combustion to coolant, cylinder to cylinder, cylinder to atmosphere, oil to atmosphere, etc. Most of the cases I see are combustion to coolant. Get the block tester. fill it with blue fluid, warm up the motor, stick the tester in the radiator opening, squeeze the bulb a few times (being careful to not suck up any coolant) and watch for the fluid to turn green/yellow. Boom. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #9 – October 09, 2012, 04:05:06 PM The "thumping" could be air bubbles in the coolant. While replacing the pump won't hurt anything, I would bet that getting the air out of the system will actually solve the problem. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #10 – October 09, 2012, 04:17:49 PM Quote from: Crazy88;400131The "thumping" could be air bubbles in the coolant. While replacing the pump won't hurt anything, I would bet that getting the air out of the system will actually solve the problem.Unless the engine is making it's own "air". If you're leaking combustion gas, it will seem like you just can't get all the air out. Use a block tester. Before you throw any more cash at it, you want to know what you're dealing with. On the other hand, if you just like throwing money away, you can throw it at me and sleep well at night. Lol Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #11 – October 09, 2012, 04:32:50 PM Quote from: TheFoeYouKnow;400134Unless the engine is making it's own "air". If you're leaking combustion gas, it will seem like you just can't get all the air out. Use a block tester. Before you throw any more cash at it, you want to know what you're dealing with. I have to agree with Foe on this one and it would probably be much cheaper in the long run if you can eliminate for certain a cracked head, block or blown head gasket. If I recall correctly though, you had already posted the results of a compression test, which should have ruled out a blown head gasket. Have you located and used the air bleeds on the engine itself? Have you filled the overflow tank, started the car bringing it up to operating temperature and then monitored the level in the overflow tank as it cools? I am not sure about that particular model, but other models in the KIA line have air bleed fittings on or very near the thermostat housing. Of course it goes without saying that the best thing you can have is a good service manual for that particular model. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #12 – October 09, 2012, 04:55:52 PM Doesn't rule out a blown head gasket at all. It rules out a major gasket failure. At cranking speed there may not be enough heat, compression or both to overcome the gasket. This may change with the engine warmed up, or with the engine above idle. I once owned a 4 cylinder mustang i bought with a blown head gasket and cracked head, once sufficiently warmed up it would smooth out and quit blowing white smoke. Basically it would expand with the heat until it sealed up. You still want to get the motor hot and run the block tester. Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #13 – October 09, 2012, 05:17:31 PM Is the block tester kit something that can be sourced locally or from Summit? Quote Selected
Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* Reply #14 – October 09, 2012, 05:24:52 PM The one we use at the shop comes from Napa. Quote Selected
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Topic: Car over heating , NON FOX , is a Kia sophia *SOLVED* (Read 2627 times)
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