Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #30 – February 15, 2012, 03:51:21 PM Out of curiosity Darren, did you swap in your 94/95 Mustang MC & Booster and drive your car for a while before swapping in SN95 Cobra spec brakes at the wheels, or did you swap everything at the same time? Your set up is what I'm going to put on the Red-Winged Blackbird. I already installed a 94/95 Stang MC and a 93 Cobra Booster. I won't have the funds for swapping the SN95 Cobra spec brake components at the wheels until this summer though. I knew the brake pedal wouldn't feel the way I wanted it to until I had installed the SN95 brake parts at the wheels, so I wasn't surprised to find out the car is hard to stop right now. It takes a fair amount of pedal pressure to stop it. I just wanted to compare notes with you to see if you went through the same weak brake thing (from running an SN95 MC on a car with small Fox brakes), or if you did it the right way and swapped everything all at the same time to have all SN95 brake parts? Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #31 – February 15, 2012, 04:22:46 PM On my '93 Mustang I originally installed 93 Mustang GT brakes on the front as it was a four cylinder car. Several years later I swapped in the full 95 GT braking system minus the combination valve (brass piece below the MC that houses the shuttle valve and proportioning valve) and ABS. MC, Booster, all the stock lines between the MC, combination valve, and ABS, front spindles and brakes, rear axles and brakes. I also installed SS braided lines from the hard lines on the car to the calipers front and back and gutted the stock proportioning valve and installed a Wilwood manual proportioning valve between the combination valve and the rear brakes. So the braking was excellent from the beginning on that car. I swapped the front cobra brakes only and ran those for over a year before I swapped out the rears and it stopped way better but I did have to adjust the Wilwood a little bit. When I swapped in the rear Cobra brakes I had to adjust the Wilwood again and the stopping power was not much better but I expected that. The larger rears hold up better on the track due to the vented design and they look a ton better behind the larger wheels.The '83 went from the stock rolling gear to the '86 SVO MC with the stock booster, SVO 73mm front calipers on 11" rotors with the GT spindles, Stainless Steel Brake Corp rear 10" disc brake conversion (swapped in a Fox Mustang 8.8 rear), and never touched the combination valve. The car stopped like shiznit to say it nicely. I was completely uneducated on brakes at this point in my life and what a waste of time and money. The stock GT setup on my '93 stopped better than this mess. I went from this straight to a 95 Mustang GT booster and MC, SN95 spindles and Cobra brakes up front, & Cobra brakes in the rear. The rear was a bit of an adventure as I had bought the 17X9 Bullitt wheels with the correct offset for the Fox width rear. I ended up getting the brackets for the Cobra brakes on Fox width axles from North Race Cars (http://www.northracecars.com/Brakes.html). The only problem with this is I cannot run ABS as there is no room in the rear for the exciter ring on the axles or the ABS sensor. I am not expecting to drive the car much so I am not as concerned as I was with the '93 as it was my daily driver at the time I put the ABS in it. The ABS is also outstanding on a track as you can just hammer the brakes without lockup which allows you to go deeper into the turns.Hope this helps.Darren Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #32 – February 16, 2012, 09:27:36 PM Yep. That clears it up for me. Thanks. I was wondering how you went about setting those cars up. :) Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #33 – April 30, 2013, 01:45:18 PM A little over two years after I started this thread, I finally bought the Town Car master cylinder! Hopefully it doesn't take me two more years to install it, lol. Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #34 – May 20, 2013, 05:37:00 PM Im redoing my brakes while i have my engine out. On top of doing an 11 inch rotor upgrade, and switching all the lines to stainless, i was reading on the cool cats page about swapping the m/c and booster for ones out of a 95 mustang, the m/c having a 1 1/16 bore. Is it worth it to do so, or should i just keep the stock booster and get another 1 inch bore m/c, stock to my car?also, why did the m/c from a svt cobra have a smaller bore than the gt?? Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #35 – May 20, 2013, 06:04:31 PM If you are not upgrading to the larger diameter brakes found in the SN95 Mustangs and converting to rear disc brakes then I would just install the same MC that came in the 87-88 TC's or an MC that has the same bore diameter. This will keep the system balanced. The smaller the diameter the piston is the higher the pressure will be. If you have a brake system with an MC that has an 1-1/8" bore and it produces 1,000 psig of pressure then the same system with a 1" bore MC will exert 1,266 psig. This is based on the principle of psig which is pounds per square inch. As the area gets smaller and all other parameters are held constant the pressure will increase. With all of that said I would say the engineers decided they needed higher clamping forces on the Cobra's calipers to effectively stop the car the way they wanted it to stop.Anyhow, make sure your booster is good and install the appropriate MC. Darren Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #36 – May 20, 2013, 07:20:36 PM The 87-88 TC has an integrated ABS electric system. Going to a 1 1/6 cylinder will make that pedal hard as hell and very hard to stop. Very little travel though. Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #37 – May 20, 2013, 07:55:29 PM ok...well i AM switching to rear discs, so i guess ill use a stock 1 inch bore, and have to figure out how to swap the tc prop valve in....why is it only the front right brake, and rear go though the prop valve, not the front left? Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #38 – May 20, 2013, 08:43:05 PM Tom,Duly noted and that is what I get for assuming.Driverguy,Okay, now that you are converting over to rear discs you need to swap over to a 93 Cobra booster and I believe a 85 Lincoln Towncar MC if the fittings on your current MC are SAE. From there you need to gut the proportioning valve side of the combination valve and install a manual style proportioning valve like a Wilwood. Anyhow that would be my approach and you would be set up if you wanted to go to the SN95 style brakes at a later date.Darren Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #39 – May 20, 2013, 08:51:30 PM Quote from: Aerocoupe;415653Tom,Duly noted and that is what I get for assuming.Driverguy,Okay, now that you are converting over to rear discs you need to swap over to a 93 Cobra booster and I believe a 85 Lincoln Towncar MC if the fittings on your current MC are SAE. From there you need to gut the proportioning valve side of the combination valve and install a manual style proportioning valve like a Wilwood. Anyhow that would be my approach and you would be set up if you wanted to go to the SN95 style brakes at a later date.Darren I thought it was supposed to be a 1995 booster?http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aaz-54-73150/overview/make/ford/model/mustang/year/1995that one....according to summit and rockauto, thats the only one for a 95 mustang, covers the cobra and the gt Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #40 – May 20, 2013, 09:05:35 PM OK first thing is the Valve goes in the rear brake system ONLY. What i do is this I use a 7/8 - 1" cylinder for good pedal feel and replace the rear line with 3/16 all the way back and remove all the 1/4" line. (this is optional and the stock TC lines are 1/4 all the way back to the calipers) I also use a trailer brake fitting on the front lines to consolidate the lines to a single line and less complication. You need not use the balance valve because it is useless in my view and takes up space. The fittings are of no concern because the lines have to be changed any way. ISO bubble is much better than inverted flair. And Copper FERRUS is the line of my choice. I do not even use STAINLESS any more as it seals rather shiznitty and there is no advantage to using it. Unless all the fittings are new they have a nasty habit of leaking.Here is a neat mounting bracket i made for the valve and trashed the balance valve and stock per-portioning valveSometimes you need both ISO and inverted flair on the same line. This line i made is for a C4 to C5 conversion. There is no trailer fitting in ISO. So i needed to make a different line set. Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #41 – May 20, 2013, 10:01:29 PM I don't understand 95% of what he was talking about there....So, i guess ill get this brake booster http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aaz-54-73150/overview/make/ford/model/mustang/year/1995 off a 95 mustang, and does it have to be the crown vic m/c? cool cats site said the crown vic replaces the 84-86 style m/c, and a 94/95 m/c was to replace the 87-88 type? Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #43 – May 21, 2013, 12:49:21 PM Quote from: Driverguy;415669I don't understand 95% of what he was talking about there....So, i guess ill get this brake booster http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aaz-54-73150/overview/make/ford/model/mustang/year/1995 off a 95 mustang, and does it have to be the crown vic m/c? cool cats site said the crown vic replaces the 84-86 style m/c, and a 94/95 m/c was to replace the 87-88 type?If your car has the AL M/C with the plastic reservoir on top, use the 95 Mustang one. If it's the solid cast piece with the sheet-metal cover, use the Crown Vic one. 15/16" to 1" bore would be sufficient. You may, or may not, have to fiddle with fittings, depending on how you run things.If you have the engine out and want to replace the booster, use the one you just listed, for the 95 Mustang.The only thing the prop valve is for is for the rear brakes. Quote Selected
Brake master cylinder upgrade? Reply #44 – May 21, 2013, 02:36:50 PM Thank you Tom for the better explanation and thank you Chuck for the knowledge on when to know what MC to use. I was not sure if the 87-88 cars had metric or SAE threaded lines but I was pretty sure the 83-86 cars have SAE. Your way of looking at it is much simpler.I do disagree with the 95 booster option over the 93 Cobra booster. Effectively they provide the same amount of boost but the Cobra unit will minimize the modifications in slotting the holes on the fire wall (if at all) to install it versus the 94-95 booster. I know this for fact as I have installed both and the Cobra unit was much easier to install and has the same pedal effort as the car with the 95 GT booster. Both cars have the exact same brake setup as well.Darren Quote Selected
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