I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #15 – March 01, 2009, 10:10:43 AM

There is not going to be a single solution to our energy needs. Solar isn't perfect, especially if you live in the north. It will fill a void in the sunny southwest. Wind isn't perfect, especially if you live in an urban area. It'll fill a void in the plains and on the two coasts, where it's always windy. Hydro isn't prefect, especially if you live in the flatlands, but it'll fill a void in the wet, hilly areas. Tidal isn't perfect, especially if you happen to live nowhere near an ocean, but it'll fill a void in coastal areas. Nuclear isn't perfect, especially if you're a liberal or bunnyhugger, but it'll help fill a void just about anywhere none of the above solutions will work. Energy security is a multi-faceted problem that will require a multi-faceted solution. Hopefully having a myriad of generation options will also result in a breakdown of current monopolies.

Scott, you wanna see a reason to get pissed off at a power company, come to Nova Scotia. Nova Scotia Power was for years a government owned agency, but was spun off to private interests a few decades ago during a "holy shiznit, we need money now" government fire sale. One of the conditions of this sale was that the price of electricity would be government regulated. This alomst sounds like it'd protect the consumer, except for a little clause in the contract: The regulators must guarantee a 10% annual return on investment for shareholders. That's right, the citizens of Nova Scotia are forced to finance a 10% return on investment for shareholders. What this means is that even if the company has to do upgrades to infrastructure or headquarters (both of which it is currently planning) that money does not come out of company coffers. The citizens of the province will see increased power rates to pay for it, because the 10% ROI is guaranteed and cannot be touched. Imagine having a 10% ROI, guaranteed, especially during these economic times????

Now if that makes you see red, the best is yet to come. Several years ago a huge natural gas deposit was found in the waters off Nova Scotia. When drilling agreements were made part of it was that NSP gets first crack at the gas, at reduced prices. This was supposed to ensure that Nova Scotians benefit from the natural resource. Millions of dollars of public money was spent routing gas lines to the province's largest power plant, Tufts Cove. Tufts Cove was an oil burning plant, the idea was to convert it to cleaner, locally produced natural gas. NSP even converted their generators so that they could run on both oil and NG.

Then the price of NG skyrocketed. NSP had a guaranteed price. Instead of burning this cheap NG and saving customers money the company bought it at the cheap price, then resold it at the higher price. Meanwhile they continued to burn oil in the generators and went screaming to the gov't for higher power rates due to increased oil costs! The gov't naturally gave them their increase. Then another increase the following year. And the following year. They're taking our natural gas at below market prices and selling it to the northeastern USA at huge profits, then buying oil from Venezuela (yes, that's right, it's not even Canadain oil) at market price and begging for more money to pay for it, even as world oil prices have fallen by better than 60% in the past year.

Someone mentioned that oil companies are not buying fuel at today's prices, they're buying at a contract price determined months ago. This may be true, but that wasn't the argument they were using when prices were on their way up and they wanted price increases RIGHT NOW. In fact the gov't regulator only gave them half their requested increase because the regulator knew they bought their oil in advance and not at those high prices.

Now NSP is begging for ANOTHER increase, even though it just got one a few months ago, because it wants to renovate its headquarters in Halifax and upgrade the transmission lines it's neglected for decades (every time there's a gust of wind the power goes out, and it's always windy in NS). The gov't regulator suggested they dig into their profits for the money, and NSP had the absolute nerve to say "You can't touch our profits, they're guaranteed to us!"

And they're right! We, the people, will end up with another increase to pay once again for upgrades to equipment we'd been paying for decades for maintenance on but was not done!

So yeah, you're not alone in being pissed at electric companies. If I had to do it again I would most certainly be "off the grid".

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #16 – March 01, 2009, 12:22:04 PM

Scott, was Allegheny Power recently deregulated? That could explain the price increase somewhat. Over the past few years several states including Pennsylvania allowed their electric companies to deregulate and let the free market determine pricing. Well guess what...I know this may come as a shock but prices went up.

We are keeping an eye on things in Ohio as deregulation is supposed to be slowly phased in. Fortunately our governor is keeping an eye on the process and has pledged not to allow gouging (and so far he's been a pretty decent governor).

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #17 – March 01, 2009, 01:24:19 PM

Thats some really crazy stuff you have going on up there in Halifax. I guess you have it worse than I do for sure.

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #18 – March 01, 2009, 03:36:36 PM

Deregulation has worked great here. All that competition among power providers has really driven prices down.:hick: (NOT)
I plugged ten years of my electric bills into a spread sheet and the trend is obvious.

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #19 – March 01, 2009, 08:59:17 PM

That is pretty cool. Go to the news and give them those pictures of your graphs.

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #20 – March 02, 2009, 02:25:38 AM

Quote from: Thunder Chicken;259015

There is not going to be a single solution to our energy needs. Solar isn't perfect, especially if you live in the north. It will fill a void in the sunny southwest. Wind isn't perfect, especially if you live in an urban area. It'll fill a void in the plains and on the two coasts, where it's always windy. Hydro isn't prefect, especially if you live in the flatlands, but it'll fill a void in the wet, hilly areas. Tidal isn't perfect, especially if you happen to live nowhere near an ocean, but it'll fill a void in coastal areas. Nuclear isn't perfect, especially if you're a liberal or bunnyhugger, but it'll help fill a void just about anywhere none of the above solutions will work. Energy security is a multi-faceted problem that will require a multi-faceted solution. Hopefully having a myriad of generation options will also result in a breakdown of current monopolies.

Your correct, and as much as I hate to side with Obama (at least his words.. I'm slow to trust any politician) his plan addresses this (at least for the US). By interconnecting all the systems with lines coast to coast, where Solar or wind falls short hydro or Geo can pick up. Coal could be connected also as well as NG or any other source. All into the same grid. California could put in solar, Ill could do wind, Wa. has the Hydro... wouldent matter where you were in the US.. wouldent matter where the power was generated.. Price of Coal goes UP.. demand for Solar or wind would fill the void.

Lets see how bad "allegheny power" wanted that cost increase then. Jcasity wouldent HAVE to buy there power then.

Gotta admit.. it's a hell of a plan (on paper anyway)

I am pissed about Electric costs

Reply #21 – March 02, 2009, 08:28:01 AM

WV has hydro as well.