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Topic: Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers... (Read 1837 times) previous topic - next topic

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

...but my car now has the appropriate number of pedals. Step one, and I'm assuming the hardest step, of the 5-speed swap is complete.  :burnout:

Holy flirking shnit, those s are hard to change! Even with the steering column and driver's seat removed from the car they're a . And the whole time I was doing it, I was saying to myself "Why didn't I do this when I had the dash out?!?!?" (speaking of which, swapping the dash was actually easier than swapping the pedals).

I've definitely committed myself to completing the swap now. I removed all the auto shifter junk from the column, so now even though the column is back in the car I have no way of shifting out of park :hick:

A few minor questions for others who have endured the misery:

1) What is that vacuum line/switch thing on top of the brake pedal? My car does not have the auto park brake release, and I can't think of any other reason there would be a vacuum thingy there. The Mustang pedals actually had the place for the switch but no switch (of course I installed mine onto the new pedals)

2) I know there's a jumper somewhere in the harness under the dash for the clutch switch. This brings up two questions: Where is that jumper, and is the jumper for the clutch/starter interlock (clutch must be depressed for starter to work) or is it for the cruise interrupt (kills cruise when clutch pressed)? There were two switches on the Mustang pedal assembly - one normally closed that opens when the pedal is pressed (I'd assume this is the cruise switch) and one normally open that closes when the pedal is pressed (and it only closes at the end of the clutch pedal travel), and I'm assuming that's the starter interrupt. I can do without that one, but I'd like to have the cruise kill function...
2015 Mustang GT Premium - 5.0, 6-speed, Guard Green - too much awesome for one car

1988 5.0 Thunderbird :birdsmily: SOLD SEPT 11 2010: TC front clip/hood ♣ Body & paint completed Oct 2007 ♣ 3.55 TC rear end and front brakes ♣ TC interior ♣ CHE rear control arms (adjustable lowers) ♣ 2001 Bullitt springs ♣ Energy suspension poly busings ♣ Kenne Brown subframe connectors ♣ CWE engine mounts ♣ Thundercat sequential turn signals ♣ Explorer overhead console (temp/compass display) ♣ 2.25" off-road dual exhaust ♣ T-5 transmission swap completed Jan 2009 ♣

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #1 –
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;247908
What is that vacuum line/switch thing on top of the brake pedal? My car does not have the auto park brake release, and I can't think of any other reason there would be a vacuum thingy there. The Mustang pedals actually had the place for the switch but no switch (of course I installed mine onto the new pedals)

"Vacuum dump valve" I think it's called. I take it you have cruise control? When you hit the brakes it kills the vacuum...I think....going to the servo, and thus shuts off cruise.
1987 20th Anniversary Cougar, 302 "5.0" GT-40 heads (F3ZE '93 Cobra) and TMoss Ported H.O. intake, H.O. camshaft
2.5" Duals, no cats, Flowmaster 40s, Richmond 3.73s w/ Trac-Lok, maxed out Baumann shift kit, 3000 RPM Dirty Dog non-lock TC
Aside from the Mustang crinkle headers, still looks like it's only 150 HP...
1988 Black XR7 Trick Flow top end, Tremec 3550
1988 Black XR7 Procharger P600B intercooled, Edelbrock Performer non-RPM heads, GT40 intake AOD, 13 PSI @5000 RPM. 93 octane

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #2 –
Ahhh, interesting. I'd always thought the cruise system used an input from the brake light circuit to kill itself when the brake pedal is depressed (that sentence seems odd - if the brake pedal is depressed shouldn't it kill itself, instead of the cruise system? Sorry, shiznitty joke). Ya learn something every day...
2015 Mustang GT Premium - 5.0, 6-speed, Guard Green - too much awesome for one car

1988 5.0 Thunderbird :birdsmily: SOLD SEPT 11 2010: TC front clip/hood ♣ Body & paint completed Oct 2007 ♣ 3.55 TC rear end and front brakes ♣ TC interior ♣ CHE rear control arms (adjustable lowers) ♣ 2001 Bullitt springs ♣ Energy suspension poly busings ♣ Kenne Brown subframe connectors ♣ CWE engine mounts ♣ Thundercat sequential turn signals ♣ Explorer overhead console (temp/compass display) ♣ 2.25" off-road dual exhaust ♣ T-5 transmission swap completed Jan 2009 ♣

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #3 –
I'm thinking the wiring for the clutch switch isn't there on a 5.0 T-bird. I know it wasn't there on my car. My dad's Mustang had it already when we swapped it to a 5 speed.

You can use the wires for the AOD's neutral switch, and run them to your clutch pedal to make it work.

The cruise cut off I dunno. You might be able to tie the clutch switch into the circuit that cuts it off when you hit the brakes.
Matt
1984 Thunderbird - 89 302 HO, GT40 heads w/ Trick Flow springs, E303 cam, Edelbrock Performer 289 intake and 600 cfm 4bbl, Mustang headers, Jegs o/r H pipe, Dynomax lers, Mustang AOD and shifter, Mustang 8.8 w/ 3.73s, 3G alternator, Mustang front and rear sway bars, KYB SN-95 front struts and shocks, and 11" front brakes.

1988 Mustang GT - GT40 heads, Explorer intake, 70mm throttle body, 70mm MAF, Crane 1.7 rrs, E303 cam, Kirban Kwik shifter w/ Pro 5.0 deluxe handle, aluminum clutch quadrant and firewall adjuster, o/r h pipe, Dynomax lers, 3G alternator, aluminum radiator, and 3.27 gears.
 
1986 Cougar 5.0, 1989 Mark VII LSC 5 speed, 1980 Mercury Zephyr 4 door (sold)

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #4 –
Shouldnt it kill itself HAHAHAHAHA im sorry "that aint right" I cant help it. :( :evilgrin: :rollin:
 
Actually if not for that added note I wouldnt have had any qualms with the original sentence LOL.
 
But yeah obviously theres the brake light switch...but I know the cruise servo shuts off from the change in vacuum due to that valve. Remember lookin at jcassity's diagrams when I was diagnosing my cruise problem. Can always tell that that thingy works right, always hear a little PWOOSHH when I hit the brakes.
1987 20th Anniversary Cougar, 302 "5.0" GT-40 heads (F3ZE '93 Cobra) and TMoss Ported H.O. intake, H.O. camshaft
2.5" Duals, no cats, Flowmaster 40s, Richmond 3.73s w/ Trac-Lok, maxed out Baumann shift kit, 3000 RPM Dirty Dog non-lock TC
Aside from the Mustang crinkle headers, still looks like it's only 150 HP...
1988 Black XR7 Trick Flow top end, Tremec 3550
1988 Black XR7 Procharger P600B intercooled, Edelbrock Performer non-RPM heads, GT40 intake AOD, 13 PSI @5000 RPM. 93 octane

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;247924
Ahhh, interesting. I'd always thought the cruise system used an input from the brake light circuit to kill itself when the brake pedal is depressed (that sentence seems odd - if the brake pedal is depressed shouldn't it kill itself, instead of the cruise system? Sorry, shiznitty joke). Ya learn something every day...

The cruise is turned off two ways. The brake switch turns off the "speed control amplifier" and the dump valve releases the vacuum from the servo motor. I guess it is redundent for safety reasons, incase one doesn't work.

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #6 –
Ahh, that explains why my motor revs up if I press the clutch in before tapping the brakes to disable cruise.

Yeah, I only use the neutral safety switch on the TKO - the track only wants you to try to start with the clutch out while in gear, so I got no issue.

Oh, and yes, replacing the pedals was the worst job ever. I think my back still hurts from that job (which I did like 8 years ago.)
11.96 @ 118 MPH old 306 KB; 428W coming soon.

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #7 –
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;247908
2) I know there's a jumper somewhere in the harness under the dash for the clutch switch. This brings up two questions: Where is that jumper, and is the jumper for the clutch/starter interlock (clutch must be depressed for starter to work) or is it for the cruise interrupt (kills cruise when clutch pressed)? There were two switches on the Mustang pedal assembly - one normally closed that opens when the pedal is pressed (I'd assume this is the cruise switch) and one normally open that closes when the pedal is pressed (and it only closes at the end of the clutch pedal travel), and I'm assuming that's the starter interrupt. I can do without that one, but I'd like to have the cruise kill function...

From page 43 & 44 of the 87 EVTM:
The jumper to bypass the nuetral safety switch is on connector C318(C501 in 3.8 & 5.0 harness)at the LH transmission support. It jumpers the R/LB wire to the W/PK wire. This is the same connector the back-up light circuit uses.
It could also be jumpered at connector C150, behind the center of I/P ,black 12 pin connector, same wire colors

To use the clutch start interlock switch (closed with clutch depressed) you could remove the W/O anti theft feature jumper and install the switch there. Page 43 C288, LH side of I/P near fuse panel, black 12 pin connector. Jumper is R/LB and jumpers the R/LB wire to W/PK wire.

EVTM page 207:
Pushing in the clutch pedal should also turn off the cruise.
Notice the clutch switch that is open with the pedal depressed.
This is a tricky circuit. When neither pedal is pushed, circuit 511 LG at the speed control amp sees ground through the brake light bulb filiments.
Pushing in the clutch pedal opens this circuit turning off cruise.
Pushing the brake pedal puts 12v on this same circuit. This also turns off cruise.

How you can adapt this to the 5.0 harness (Page 206), you are own your own there.

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #8 –
Where the clutch switch to shut off the cruise should go.

 

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #9 –
If you wire the clutch switch in as described in the above drawing the brake light would not be on while setting at a stop light with the clutch pushed in and your foot on the brake.
87 TC
HO Swap, T5 Swap, Mach Springs, CHE Upper and Lower control arms, Mach Chin spoiler, soon to be Procharged.

:evilgrin: Nitrous is like a hot chick with an STD you want to hit it but are scared of the consequences. :evilgrin:

Just spent the last three hours cursing Ford engineers...

Reply #10 –
Quote from: bigbada1;248087
If you wire the clutch switch in as described in the above drawing the brake light would not be on while setting at a stop light with the clutch pushed in and your foot on the brake.

Not true.