CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

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CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

April 01, 2008, 03:21:24 PM

As you have probably read a while ago, i re-copied this post from my brother just as a reminder to as where we all left off.
The problem with this 1988 (built Oct 87) Thunderbird 3.8L V6 EFI (not CFI). 69,000 orginal miles, (this car was babied) is that she is very picky!

A brief description; I bought the car with Blown Head Gaskets. Based on talking to the mechanic at the garage i bought it from, and from a visual inspection of the car, I can tell you this is maybe what happened:
The original radiator had died, lowering overall pressure and coolant levels in the block, which would in turn overheat. When the new radiator went in, it brought the pressure back up and blew the gasket. My brother (CougarXLS) and I since completed this task, and managed to get her running. During the reconstruction job, we completly rebuilt the exhaust system (short of the y-pipe with the dual cats).

Before got her running, but after re-assembly, we couldn't get her to start, much less crank-over. So, a new battery, starter motor go in, and she cranks but doesn't fire. So in goes a new TFI-IV ignition module, resulting in a better controlled crank. I did a compression test, just to verify everything goin' on within the block, all good. After another visual inspection I discover the rotor under the distributer cap was broken. Ten bucks, perfect. Replaced. And, She's ALIVE!! I had her running for about 30 minutes before shutting the car off. Everything seemed to be okay, so I thought...

Now, after I start the car, she'll go through the cold-choke warmup routine, then stall. CougarXLS can keep the engine running with his foot on the pedal, but as soon as his foot comes off the pedal, she stalls.

I have thought about timing being off, but it has not changed from the evening where I had got her to run for 30mins. It must be something new.

The only other point worth mentioning is the serpentine belt. It seems to have frayed (as if it wasn't lined up properly with the pullys), today I will replace it. Could this lack of cohesion in the belt produce enough drag on the engine to stall it out? Or would it be more likely that it's an accessory (i.e. alternator, smog pump) that has siezed?

Before I got the car running, I was doing a lot of cranking, which in turn drains the battery. After the car was running, it seemed to be charging it's own battery (as after I got her running, I didn't need the charger or the booster), however, on the last run, I let the engine run with my foot on the accelerator for about 10 mins. I had to get the booster out to try to start it again after she stalled.

If it's not the belt (or if the belt is a symptom), and if it is not a sticky alternator what may it be?...

Any suggestions from anyone would be more than appreciated.

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #1 – April 01, 2008, 03:45:46 PM

Why did you copy and paste my original thread?
She's ALIVE!

Some of the information is out of date or has been addressed. When I find my notes, I will update this thread.

Recall, before we can start work on Salt, we need to get her unburried. Call it spring fever eh?

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #2 – April 04, 2008, 10:26:49 AM

One thing, If the HGs blew. Its much more likely that the old radiator let the car overheat. The 3.8s love to blow HGs right after they overheat. Not that its that important why they went.

The Serp belt will not cause the car to stall (unless one of your accessories is on its way out.) You can run the car briefly without the belt if you want to prove it to yourself.

My Calibrated eyeball would tell me you have a vacuum leak. 9 times out of 10 when I put the top end of a engine back together, I left a hose off somewhere.

If you plug the intake with your hand, the engine will start to stumble and die. Listen for a sucking noise. That will get you in the right area if its a hose.

If you check around the site you will see TONS of vac troubleshooting procedures.

Have you pulled codes?

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #3 – April 05, 2008, 10:56:35 AM

Thank-you danzajax,

as I mentioned above, there is some info that is out of date, I will update this thread when I find my notes (or when the snow releases grip on Salt), which ever happens first :)

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #4 – April 05, 2008, 12:14:52 PM

Have you run codes? At least the KOEO ones?

How long did it sit before running the 30 min?

As mentioned, check for hoses that might have fallen off after the initial run. Also make sure all plug wires are still attached to the plugs as well.

You might try a new battery, or at least charge the one that is in there up (not with the car running...with a charger). Might have it checked as well as the alternator just to be sure.

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #5 – April 06, 2008, 06:05:03 PM

Thank You very much, I really appreciate ur advice, yes I did run codes and Im still trying to work it out. I have missed a few days there, but hopefully i can go back out 2morrow. I hope it is something like a loose plug or hose, but i honestly dont know. It sat for a few months before it ran for 30min, and it has a new battery, starter, altenator etc (All the esentials). However, its been sitting for a few more months now... I will look everything that i did over again and i will keep u posted. perhaps u can continue to diognose for the next stage in this cars life...:D

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #6 – April 15, 2008, 11:19:52 AM

Well, since I had a loose end on this thread to tie up...

I have found my notes and recall were we left off on Salt

It was indeed timing. I was never able to finish that diagnostic before I needed the garage for Cougar X... then the snow came, yada yada yada....

No codes, no ground faults, no electrical faults... it was timing.

The engine is now running. However, there is still one nagging problem we must address.... the Automatic Tensioner.

The belt is still jumping the tensioner. SaltNPepper & myself are waiting for a replacement tensioner from Vinnietbird, here's hoping it will be a simple replacement.

Closer and closer to CatJam!

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #7 – April 15, 2008, 01:33:35 PM

One bolt,and that's it.It was shipped out last week I believe.let me know when you get it,and,as always,leave feedback

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #8 – April 16, 2008, 12:06:50 PM

We'll find out either today or tomorrow :)
Thank-you Vinnie... we received the tensioner today.

WE DID IT!! thanx 2 r 'one n only'...

Reply #9 – April 21, 2008, 05:43:05 PM

A HUGE Thank you goes out to Vinnietbird!!! thank u so much for all ur help and guess what....

SALT IS ON THE ROAD!!!!:birdsmily:

away she flies!! thnx 4 ur interest and feedback Vinny!! it is appreciated by alll! What a birthday present for my car and me!! SWEET! i am tfhe happiest person alive|!!

It was the timing and it was off by about 1/4" and she cleared her throat! now she is running great and all paperwork is done, she is on the road again!!!

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #10 – April 21, 2008, 06:06:49 PM

For reasons like these, I am reminded of why I love my Cougars, why I love this forum......!!!

I am sooo happy for my SaltNPepper! And I thank everyone, especially Vinnietbird, for their assistance and suggestions in making this a reality for my sister :)

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #11 – April 21, 2008, 08:38:55 PM

Congratulations! It's always great to get the car on the road after its had problems.

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #12 – April 27, 2008, 01:05:55 PM

Thank u, 4 sure....I dont know if im outta the woods yet, she is running great and i hate to say anything bad to jinx it and i cant ask 4 better, but it seems like the car holds off on going into gear. it will go with a grunt when it does but if i floor it, this doesnt happen so much. i hope the Tranny is gunna last...does anyone know why this happens??

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #13 – April 27, 2008, 08:37:43 PM

I don't mean to put words in your mouth, SaltNPepper, but having been in the car myself, it feels as though, the AOD tranny doesn't want to let go of the gear she's in. Except when she floors it... then it just shifts relatively smoothly.

There are no error codes, no problems in breakout box diagnostics, this is most definitly some kind of mechanical problem*.

*Edit: Just thought of this, after reading my own post... SaltNPepper has reported the column shifter is still really 'sticky' (i.e. hard to physically move). Could there be a physical mis-alignment with the linkages? Perhaps because of this 'sticky' column not properly seating the tranny in Drive?

SaltNPepper, we should test Salt tomorrow and see if the problem persists with the tranny is placed in D instead of D (with AOD).

Any ideas anyone?

CougarXLS said about Thunderbird

Reply #14 – April 28, 2008, 06:03:32 PM

The first Book of Ford AOD States:
"If Ye experiences weird shifts. Thou shall checkith thy Kickith Downith Cable and bushing."

Having the cable out of adjustment can cause the trans to hold gears longer than normal.