spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED March 29, 2008, 02:05:30 AM I threw together a few pics of a new (unused) and a two month old inner front bearing.The inner race is grooved on the 2 month old one and how it compares to the new one.I also drew up a pic of the spindal indicating the wear area. For the longest time, i thought the innner race of the inner bearing was conical or completely tapered. I am wrong. So, since the inner race can not seem to get into a proper bind as to not spin, are there any solutions other than the obvious. I called a few of you a couple days ago and got ahold of one person to discuss. New spindals are an option but i would rather stay away from used.Is there a known repair or shim stock perhaps? I am sure the spindal can be recut to the proper taper. The question is the cost effective nature. Has anyone looked into this issue deeper?I did not get a chance to change these a couple days ago so sunday i will waste my money and put them in. I dont have spindals and the bearings are making noise again. The only thing ill do different this time is r/r the races from the rotors. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #1 – March 29, 2008, 02:14:21 AM another thing,,Im probably a little guilty of over greasing.,, meaning,,,,,,I slide the rotor on and leave the outter bearing off.I then stick the grease gun in the gap and fill up the void with grease.I will then install my outter , the keyway washer and tighten the nut letting all excess grease ooze out. I was told that doing that may be preventing me from getting the back of the inner to seat properly because the thick grease adds up to space taken as well.As the grease heats, it melts and runs out and thus an unwanted gap.Finally, as i tighten the nut, i will spin the wheel as i feel the bearings bind and the wheel will not turn. I back off 1/4 turn or just until the wheel is free again and leave it there.I was told that its ok to do what im doing but avoid getting any grease on the taper side of the inner so it remains metal to metal and binds.oh well.thanks for the input in advancescott Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #2 – March 29, 2008, 02:18:10 AM It's hard to see exactly what you got there, so the inner races spinning on the spindle shaft? Is this because the spindle has thinned in that area and the races are not "snug" on the spindle shaft? The only other thing I can think of is the castle nut was tight and made the bearing bind thus forcing the inner race to rotate (seems unlikely after your second post while I was typing :hick: ). I was a little worried about mine spinning as the spindle shafts are "dented" from years of being hammered on when the car hit a bump. So far, so good - but now you've got me concerned :D On edit (after seeing second post) - it seems unlikely, but are you forcing any grease between the race & spindle shaft by tightening with no place for all that grease to go? Maybe - based on your description? Dunno :shrug: On edit: it seems like you've answered your own question :hick: Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #3 – March 29, 2008, 10:39:30 PM Im actually looking for ideas on this for a multitued of reasons. Many people have this problem and really dont know it or just think the front makes "that normal" noise.For the first time, thishiznit home when i removed the driver rotor on the 20th and found the outter had come apart. the only shim stock i have available is a few old feeler guages which are made of good metal. I would like to use something .003 or smaller to put the curvature of the inner race / inner bearing in a bind upon tightening.Im just reaching out to anyone whos had similar issues and what thier solution was.Im not really sure ive explained myself well enough either. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #4 – March 30, 2008, 02:22:00 PM im pretty surprised this thread is on its way to the bottom. Im on my way out to do the bearings now,,again. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #5 – March 30, 2008, 02:27:53 PM You need a camera with a decent macro focus Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #6 – March 30, 2008, 02:53:14 PM I've never heard of a bearing spinning on a spindle unless the bearing seized up, which of course would have done way more damage than that. A possibility is that it's a poor fitting aftermarket bearing. A Ford bearing would be made specifically for the application, but an aftermarket one may be "close enough", resulting in a not quite tight fit.Another possibility is a bent spindle causing the bearing to sit funny (crooked) on it...Oh, and lesson 1 of "Spindle Education" is:How to spell "Spindle" :hick: Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #7 – March 30, 2008, 03:03:27 PM Quote from: Thunder Chicken;211688A possibility is that it's a poor fitting aftermarket bearing. A Ford bearing would be made specifically for the application, but an aftermarket one may be "close enough", resulting in a not quite tight fit.I thought of that,,,,, and i dont have the right tools to measure it (like most of us). At best, when these act up again, ill try a different vendor. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #8 – March 30, 2008, 04:23:12 PM The front bearings both inner and outer that I got from rock auto for my 87 TC that are suppose to be ford had aftermarket bearings in the ford boxes. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #9 – March 30, 2008, 10:36:47 PM I think ive figured out what the guy up in wash dc was trying to tell me about visually seeing if the spindal is worn.In the pic below with bearings on the spindal, there is no gap between the inner bearing inner race backshell and the spindal assembly. I think there should be for a good fit for duty spindal.the first pic shows just the spindal and a couple of notes.I was able to put my new inner bearing on by hand and while keeping a good presure on it, i turned the bearings outter part. The innner tried to follow as well. This makes sense though because how would you be able slide the rotor on and off if it were too tight of a fit. I know this is not good so i set out thinking of my options from loc-tite to shim stock. I decided to go with shim stock.Today, I cut a 1/8'' wide part of my .001 feeler guage (type with flip out pieces of stainless steel) piece of metal and was able to manage it in between my inner bearing inner race. I used my tin snips to cut this very thin metal long ways and it worked great. It ended up being about 1/8'' wide x 3'' L. This will put the inner race in a bind so as to not turn. I will not know the results until i drive for a few more weeks so stay tuned. My 15 mile test drive went great and no noises up front. On a side note, my rack/pinion needs replacing.My only goal here was to install something that would bind the inner race """EARLIER"""" up on the spindal and also not cantering it sideways. The event of installing the shim stock strip was very easy. I was able to manage it in place holding it in line from the back side of the rotor. I installed the rotor slowly until it started to binde a little. I then used my hammer to lightly tap the rotor up on the spindal the remaining distance. **as i suspected**- it got harder the further up the spindal the inner bearing went. This was a good thing as that confirmed my goal of binding the inner was working. With such a narrow piece of metal, you all know we are not talking about much of a gap. Hopefully that gap is filled and these bearings will last a while. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #10 – April 02, 2008, 12:12:10 AM 200 miles on the shim stock and no noise to report.Tomorrow I will drive to spartanburg SC late in the eve to be on a site at midnight for power work. I Will be leaving for Ashville NC around 7am for a site survey at 9-10am. From there I will be heading to Smith Mountain lake VA for a Cell site survey later that evening.I will be heading home after that.Just a few more miles on the 20th, but ill let everyone know how the shim stock holds up after this trip.Next week looks like Ft Wayne IN again. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #11 – April 05, 2008, 03:17:54 AM an additional 800 miles since 3apr and no noise.Next week will be to Wash DC, southern Jersey and back to the office in Wv. Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #12 – April 07, 2008, 01:21:36 PM jcassity:Did you give some thought that the shim stock may cause the bearing to be pen 15-eyed. My guess is you weren't able to get it shimmed for a complete 360 degrees. What type of gap are you dealing with between start/end of the shim? Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #13 – April 15, 2008, 10:20:16 PM jcassity:May be addressing this issue myself shortly.FWIW: Here's a couple links to spindle sleeves. Same concept of using shim.http://www.daemar.com/shaft_repair_sleeves_17.htmlhttp://www2.vsm.skf.com/usa_english/node920.aspx Quote Selected
spindal education , wear and repair SOLVED Reply #14 – April 17, 2008, 03:34:30 AM good find but if you do the math on what i explained,, what thickness are am i dealing with.i have given you a width and thickness of the shim. you do the math on the orbital gap. To date and about 3k miles added, no vibration from my rotors. When i nstalled the shim, it had no choice but to go on straight or what would be considered mechanicaly good enough. My rotors spin free and i do not feel any bearing jumping when i slowly rotate the wheels.The level of alignment you are talking about would be the ideal goal but the tolerance here was so tight, i dont even think they make a shaft sleeve that thin. Average tin foil is .003.The shim i used was from a feeler guage. I cut the .001 flip out portion long ways in four pieces. I used one strip on each rotor which needed some additional trim lengh ways which made it even more narrow but 1/8'' was and estimate and good enough for the sake of conversation.I tested each strip with an inner bearing to insure i custom trim each piece to the proper width just shy of pushing the bearing/shim all the way up the spindal.I assembled my rotors with new parts and held the tiny narrow piece of shim with one finger to the inside of the inner bearing inner race adn nudged it on the spindal. I then tapped gently with a rubber hammer until the rotor was seated all the way back. When I got close to seating the inner bearing all the way back, i had to use my old outter bearing and washer as a place to set a socket and then tap on the socket with the hammer until I felt like the inner bearing was as far back as it would go.I drove the car, came back home, jacked up a wheel, reset the spinal nut again which was nothing really to speak of and called it good.No problems to date and I call it fixed.The sleeve size i would imagine i require would be in the range of .0005 or thinner for entire shaft coverage. Now that would be a tall order for any compay to fill i think.SOLVED. Quote Selected
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