Need engine project advice.

Topic: Need engine project advice. (Read 6627 times) previous topic - next topic

Need engine project advice.

Reply #15 – April 05, 2012, 05:55:38 PM

I used them and there x pipe for a 5.0 stang

Need engine project advice.

Reply #16 – April 05, 2012, 08:26:34 PM

Yeah I'd run the GT40X heads if you're getting them for $500 a pair

Need engine project advice.

Reply #17 – April 06, 2012, 07:19:01 AM

Quote from: thewestie;386117

I used them and there x pipe for a 5.0 stang

Did they work well?

Need engine project advice.

Reply #18 – April 06, 2012, 09:49:59 AM

Update, the heads aren't GT40X, they're GT40 M-6049-Y303's and according to the spec sheets of both, the Y303's out flow the X heads by a small amount on intake, but by like 10 percent on the exhaust.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #19 – April 06, 2012, 10:27:56 AM

The GT40 Y303's are ok heads. Not quite as good as the GT40X but for $500 they're a deal :).

Need engine project advice.

Reply #20 – April 06, 2012, 11:16:58 AM

I'd go for used edelbrock or trickflow alum heads for ~$700-$800, used cobra intake, 65mm tb, 24# injectors, and a tfs-1 cam. I had this combo in my old tbird with a t-5 and 355's and it ran great.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #21 – April 06, 2012, 03:00:28 PM

Quote from: Bob;386172

I'd go for used edelbrock or trickflow alum heads for ~$700-$800, used cobra intake, 65mm tb, 24# injectors, and a tfs-1 cam. I had this combo in my old tbird with a t-5 and 355's and it ran great.

I'll have this same combo (Edelbrock heads, GT40 intake, 65mm TB, 24lb injectors) with a Comp cam and 3.73s soon. The heads will be the only difference from the curent combo as I have all of the stuff except with GT40Ps. I should get a noticeable improvement with the Edlebrock heads over the GT40Ps.

If you can swing it skip the aluminum GT40Ys and go with a set of Edelbrocks or Trick Flows.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #22 – April 06, 2012, 05:14:17 PM

Quote from: TheFoeYouKnow;386156

Did they work well?

The headers have enough clearance to work on in the car and matched up to the x pipe perfectly. I installed the motor with them on and have had them off in the car.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #23 – April 07, 2012, 09:05:07 AM

GT40Y's +$200-$300 dollars in porting will outflow box stock Eddy Performers if the porter knows what they are doing. Been there seen it.

Here is my current combo is it is putting down 318 rwhp:

Motor
Edelbrock Performer RPM 2.02 heads box stock
Comp Cams double roller timing chain
Comp Cams camshaft P/N 35-518-8
Crane 1:6 full roller rockers
DSS Super Pro flat top pistons
Crower Sportsman rods
Stock crank
Stock block 0.030" over

Induction
Edelbrock Performer RPM II upper and lower
BBK 70mm throttle body
2001 Mustang GT mass air meter (80mm)
BBK inner fender cold air kit

Exhaust
BBK 1-5/8" equal length shorties
BBK 2-1/2" off road X-pipe
Flow master lers
Dynomax 2-1/2" tail pipes

Fuel System
42 lb/hr injectors
stock fuel rails & fuel lines
Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator
Walbro 255 lphr intanke fuel pump

The motor is about 10:1 and I run it on 93 octane. The EEC is an A9L that has a SCT switch chip. The car was dyno tuned and produced 318 rwhp and 332 ft-lbs of torque. The dyno graph is not a peaker either. It comes on like a freight train at 2,500 and pulls to the chip at 6,000. The power under the curve is fat all the way across this range. Don't look for a dyno graph that looks like a mountain as the area under the curve is where races are won and lost.

The biggest thing I can tell you is call Comp Cams and have them spec a camshaft and make sure your engine builder knows how it needs to be installed.

Darren

Need engine project advice.

Reply #24 – April 07, 2012, 04:05:25 PM

There isn't much differance between the tf1 and e cam. There basically copies of each other. Most of the time a stock h.o. cam is faster, even though it doesn't dyno as high. I would run the largest exhaust I could swing, and I would try for a carb style intake if your comfortable with drilling and tapping efi stuff onto it. The boss's are alrwady there.

Do a double roller timing chan. The "gears" are a waste of time. They wear out faster, make noise and lose power over a chain.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #25 – April 07, 2012, 06:02:15 PM

I forgot to mention that if you stay with a Cobra style upper and lower I would highly suggest that you send the lower to get ported and port matched to the heads you are going to use. I did this with the old motor before the one I detailed above. It only gained about 10 peak hp but the area under the curve fattened up and the torque was definitely noticeable. The guy that did mine is Tom Moss and it was $100 plus shipping. His site it here:

http://tmossporting.0catch.com/

Darren

Need engine project advice.

Reply #26 – April 07, 2012, 06:31:10 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe;386233

GT40Y's +$200-$300 dollars in porting will outflow box stock Eddy Performers if the porter knows what they are doing. Been there seen it.

Here is my current combo is it is putting down 318 rwhp:

Motor
Edelbrock Performer RPM 2.02 heads box stock
Comp Cams double roller timing chain
Comp Cams camshaft P/N 35-518-8
Crane 1:6 full roller rockers
DSS Super Pro flat top pistons
Crower Sportsman rods
Stock crank
Stock block 0.030" over

Induction
Edelbrock Performer RPM II upper and lower
BBK 70mm throttle body
2001 Mustang GT mass air meter (80mm)
BBK inner fender cold air kit

Exhaust
BBK 1-5/8" equal length shorties
BBK 2-1/2" off road X-pipe
Flow master lers
Dynomax 2-1/2" tail pipes

Fuel System
42 lb/hr injectors
stock fuel rails & fuel lines
Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator
Walbro 255 lphr intanke fuel pump

The motor is about 10:1 and I run it on 93 octane. The EEC is an A9L that has a SCT switch chip. The car was dyno tuned and produced 318 rwhp and 332 ft-lbs of torque. The dyno graph is not a peaker either. It comes on like a freight train at 2,500 and pulls to the chip at 6,000. The power under the curve is fat all the way across this range. Don't look for a dyno graph that looks like a mountain as the area under the curve is where races are won and lost.

The biggest thing I can tell you is call Comp Cams and have them spec a camshaft and make sure your engine builder knows how it needs to be installed.

Darren

Hmm your cam has about 15* more duration on the intake and exhaust than the Comp cam I'm running. I'm going to keep the 24lb injectors on my engine when I swap the Edelbrock Performers on. I was wondering why you went with 42lb injectors when the 24lb injectors should be enough? Nitrous?

Need engine project advice.

Reply #27 – April 08, 2012, 08:41:24 AM

I had planned to do port matching throughout the inlet/outlet tract, as well as some slightly more ambitious porting in the heads. The Y heads feature smaller ports than the X heads, but I talked to a place that's local for me, and they reckon, that i should be able to get to 185cc and 75cc on the intake and exhaust ports, respectively. I've been getting a lot of recommendations to have the exhaust valves enlarged to 1.6" as 302's are crazy about more exhaust (hence the tfs s1 cam with higher lift and longer duration on exhaust) I was planning to mill also, but considering I'm making a piston change, some have recommended against it. Like thunderjet, I've got some 24# injectors that I'll be using unless I install them and have problems leaning out. But for me, with this, less is more. I'm looking for OE like driveability, 340 to 375HP at around 5 or 5.5k. And where possible I like the idea of running the parts I get a discount on. But I think I've decided on a 306. The 357 had a definite torque advantage, but with the 306, I should be getting at least 300lb-ft anywhere my torque converter will take me, and on up to the 375 -395 range.

Need engine project advice.

Reply #28 – April 09, 2012, 03:21:42 PM

Thunderjet302,
The 24 lb/hr injectors are good to about 300 flywheel hp. When you get up to that hp range they are being driven at 100% of their duty cycle so the bottom end drops out and they dribble on idle which causes all kinds of issues with surging at the lower rpm's where you want the car to idle. I use the calculator on this site to size injectors:

http://www.witchhunter.com/injectorcalc1.php4

I used the 42 lb/hr injectors as my tuner could work with them with the smaller 306 and the cars runs so much better with them over the 24 lb/hr injectors. My motor making 318 hp at the rear wheels is closer to 365 flywheel hp.

TheFoeYouKnow,
Are you talking flywheel or rear wheel hp? If you are talking rwhp then I can almost guarantee that a 302/306 cubic inch motor with the cam you are wanting to use, the heads (ported or not), a small exhaust, etc you will not see 340 to 370 hp and the 375-395 ft-lbs of torque in the 5,000 to 5,500 rpm range. You have to spin it up to 6,500+ rpms, run a solid roller cam, and get a big exhaust so that that little motor will make better power naturally aspirated. There is all kinds of internet lore about someone making huge power with a 302 with stock configured heads, hydraulic roller cam, a small exhaust, and in the 5,00 to 5,500 rpm band but its with power adders.

I am not trying to be a kill joy here but its just what I seen over the years. Another alternative is to cruise Craig's list, local papers, forums, etc and you can find 331 short blocks or the 331 kits for dirt cheap right now. The additional cubic inches will help the torque immensely which will up the hp numbers as well.

Darren

Need engine project advice.

Reply #29 – April 09, 2012, 04:14:00 PM

Quote from: Aerocoupe;386399

Thunderjet302,
The 24 lb/hr injectors are good to about 300 flywheel hp. When you get up to that hp range they are being driven at 100% of their duty cycle so the bottom end drops out and they dribble on idle which causes all kinds of issues with surging at the lower rpm's where you want the car to idle. I use the calculator on this site to size injectors:

http://www.witchhunter.com/injectorcalc1.php4

I used the 42 lb/hr injectors as my tuner could work with them with the smaller 306 and the cars runs so much better with them over the 24 lb/hr injectors. My motor making 318 hp at the rear wheels is closer to 365 flywheel hp.

Ah. I'm going by the Ford Racing calculator which says I should be ok with 24lb injectors, given that I have a smaller cam and the 1.90 valve performers. If they don't work out I can always step up to bigger injectors as they are stupid easy to swap in. I figure the car might make 320hp at the flywheel if I'm lucky.