Lemme start over . . . .

Topic: Lemme start over . . . . (Read 3604 times) previous topic - next topic

Lemme start over . . . .

August 10, 2011, 06:12:02 PM

Here is the story:

My Cougar sat for three years while we lived in Chicago (we had an apartment and I couldn't bear the thought of street parking it in the city, to say nothing of the traffic and the salty Chicago winter streets). Now that we are back on the plains I am trying to get it whipped back into shape. But there is a problem with the charging system.

I have a new Motorcraft battery (replaced under warranty) a new remanufactured O'Reilly alternator with an internal regulator (replaced under warranty), a new serpentine belt, a new solenoid, and a new alternator connector plug.

I have no problem starting the car (as long as I keep the battery charged). But the dashboard voltmeter guage is reading low and the warning chime is on. I have had the system tested at two different places, and both said the alternator wasn't producing any output. But I took it out and had it bench tested this morning, and everything checked out fine.

So my conclusion is that the alternator is working fine, but it is not making contact with the battery.

We just moved to a new town and I and haven't yet found a regular mechanic, but I took it to one guy today who said it was probably a fusable link. If so, how do you test for that? I have a test light and a battery-powered continuity tester, and I just picked up a multimeter today (those things are not as expensive as I thought they were).

I was also thinking about replacing the connector plug for the internal regulator (since I've already replaced the connector plug for the alternator).

And someone also suggested replacing the negative battery cable. But if there was a problem with that cable I would have a hard time starting the car, wouldn't I?

Anyway, any other suggestions, or any tips on how to test the fusible links, is much appreciated. The troubleshooting was fun for awhile (after that cramped apartment, having my own driveway and a garage is a little slice of heaven) but it is starting to get old. Time to get this fixed so I can get out on the highway and open the sunroof, you know?

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #1 – August 10, 2011, 07:24:49 PM

OK start the car and bring the RPM'S up to 1100. Put your voltmeter on the battery and read the charging voltage with a medium load (headlights on Etc) Tyhre meter should read anywhere between 14-14.5 VOLTS. If it does not do that the alternator is not working. Check this and POST BACK, Thanks

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #2 – August 10, 2011, 11:53:53 PM

How's the battery cables? Cable to the starter? Connections?

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #3 – August 11, 2011, 04:55:27 PM

Hi Tom. With the car running, the output is only 12 volts. When I start turning stuff on, it drops even further. So the alternator isn't working. But since the alternator checked out fine when removed and tested independently, I figured I must be looking at a wiring problem. Or is there something else I should look at?

Thanks!

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #4 – August 11, 2011, 06:05:10 PM

The alternator is wired incorrectly if it is a good unit. How did you wire it??? And post the voltages on the plug except the stator leads.

Heavy battery lead the one with the nut goes to starter solenoid battery side.
A jumps to heavy battery lead at alt
S is jumped to s Single lead to the 3 wire lead
I goes to key switch battery or alt light wire.

Note alt light circuit must have a good bulb and a 10 OHM resistor across it. If not full key battery is required

Check with a test light and post back results on all plug cavities except S

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #5 – August 11, 2011, 08:54:20 PM

Thanks Tom. I haven't changed any of the wiring from the last working configuration with ONE possible exception: When I put the new connector plug on the alternator, I forgot to pay attention to the order of the two identically-colored wires (black with orange stripe) that run into the connector plug. Since they are colored the same I figured it didn't matter, but if anyone knows otherwise I'd be glad to hear it.

Two other pieces of information I found out today: When I wasn't driving the car, it was parked at my brother's place. He told me today that one time he jump started it, and when he did there were a couple of popping noises inside the passenger cabin. Also, today I noticed that the aftermarket radio won't turn on. A couple weeks ago I went through all the fuses and everything was fine, so I don't know if that has anything to do with my problem or not.

Tom, I'd be happy to check out all the other stuff you mentioned, but I'm just a novice so you will have to tell me what A, S, and I refer to.

Thanks.

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #6 – August 11, 2011, 09:15:29 PM

Sorry that is the plug for the regulator. It is actually marked on it. Look closely and you will see what i am talking about. Does your car have a generator or alternator light?? Or does it have an AMMETER?? Thanks

http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread.php?29841-Alternator-wiring-diagrams-1G-2G-and-3G

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #7 – August 11, 2011, 10:46:04 PM

Thanks for the link. I guess I should have mentioned in the first place that my alternator is the original 2G style. I will check into those connections tomorrow. So I just need to run a test light between each pr0ng and the corresponding slot on the plug (except S)?

Also, I have the digital dash, so it shows a gauge measuring volts, but I guess I don't know if it's actually accurate. I've heard that some of the guages on the digital dash are just dummy lights disguised as gauges.

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #8 – August 12, 2011, 03:09:50 AM

So did I miss it somewhere? Have you checked voltage from the orange/black wires on the alternator to the battery ground? If you disconnect the plug at the alternator, and put your positive lead on the pin for Orange/Black, and your negative lead on battery ground, do you have 12v? Because if you don't, you popped a fusible link as far as I understand it.

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #9 – August 12, 2011, 07:36:05 PM

should have mentioned in the first place that my alternator is the original 2G style.

These alternators were GARBAGE and reflected many a car blowing up in FLAMES. The plug melts and does all types of strange things. Up date it to a 3G and UP date the wiring. Their are ALT companies that have direct fit alternators that eliminate that badly designed plug. Good luck

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #10 – August 12, 2011, 07:38:48 PM

http://www.aimpartsonline.com/files/AIM%20White%20Paper%20-%202G%20Solution%20_rev%206-08_%20_2_.pdf

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #11 – August 12, 2011, 11:35:24 PM

Quote from: nbzimmer;364928

So my conclusion is that the alternator is working fine, but it is not making contact with the battery.

You could be right.

Quote

We just moved to a new town and I and haven't yet found a regular mechanic, but I took it to one guy today who said it was probably a fusable link. If so, how do you test for that?

You do what jrad235 suggested. You pull off the connector with the two BK/O wires and check for 12v on the wires. If no 12v, the fuse link is blown.
At the starter solenoid you have two BK/O wires that each go to three fuse links.On the one with three black fuse links, one of these goes to the alternator.
Look for one that the insulation looks like it over heated. If you can stretch the fuse link, the wire inside it is blown.
If it is blown you will have to replace it with a 16 gauge fuse link.

Quote from: nbzimmer;365005

When I put the new connector plug on the alternator, I forgot to pay attention to the order of the two identically-colored wires (black with orange stripe) that run into the connector plug. Since they are colored the same I figured it didn't matter, but if anyone knows otherwise I'd be glad to hear it.

You were right it doesn't matter. The two wires are tied together.

Quote

Two other pieces of information I found out today: When I wasn't driving the car, it was parked at my brother's place. He told me today that one time he jump started it, and when he did there were a couple of popping noises inside the passenger cabin.

If he hooked the jumper cables up backwards, that would have blown the fuse link to the alternator.

Quote from: nbzimmer;365010

Also, I have the digital dash, so it shows a gauge measuring volts, but I guess I don't know if it's actually accurate.

Are you sure you don't have alternator warning light? The EVTM indicates you do have one, but it could be wrong. It may not be labled but have a logo of a battery on the lens.
If you have one, it should come on when you turn the key on and go off when you start the car. This would indicate that the alternator is "turning on".

Quote from: jrad235;365024

So did I miss it somewhere? Have you checked voltage from the orange/black wires on the alternator to the battery ground? If you disconnect the plug at the alternator, and put your positive lead on the pin for Orange/Black, and your negative lead on battery ground, do you have 12v? Because if you don't, you popped a fusible link as far as I understand it.

Do this.

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #12 – August 14, 2011, 12:05:14 AM

Once again back probe the connector on the alternator and post the results. Either with a meter or better yet a test light. Do it with the car keyed in run position and engine not running. Then in running condition. The I is very critical and the 2 heavy wires should have battery from the fuse link. Do this and post back and i will see if i can help you. Or talk you through the trouble. Use the prints i posted to help you with the colors and the troubleshooting. Once again those spade tip connector alternators are JUNK. Find the fuse links and yank on them. If they separate they are BLOWN!!

Youmare looking for fuse link A Left side fender apr0n is its location according to ALLDATA

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #13 – August 14, 2011, 03:39:59 PM

Ok, so between the negative post and the black/orange wire at the alternator connector plug, I get 0.5 volts. Also, a test light between the spade on the alternator and its corresponding wire on the plug connector does not light up.

I guess I may have misunderstood about the battery light, I thought you were talking about the gauge. I can't say as I remember if there is a light on the dash, but if I do have one it is NOT lighting up when I turn the key on.

I had read on some other posts to look for melted or damaged fuse links, but they all look fine to me from the outside. I also gave each one a moderate tug and nothing came apart. Those wires are all kind of in a jumble and it's hard to tell which ones run where. Are there any markers to determine which one runs to the alternator? This is what I have. It all looks original to me.

One wire off the solenoid is black. It splits into three 16ga fuse links.
-one fuse link has a yellow wire coming out of it.
-one fuse link has a black w/ orange wire coming out of it.
-one fuse link has two wires coming out, one yellow and one black.

The other wire coming off the solenoid is black w/ orange. It also splits into three.
-one 16ga fuse link with a black w/ orange wire coming out of it.
-one 20ga fuse link with a yellow wire coming out of it.
-one 20 ga fuse link with a black w/ orange wire coming out of it.

Is it possible to tell from this information which one runs to the alternator or do I have to dig in and start separating out the wiring routes?

Thanks for all the help. A 3G upgrade sounds like a good idea for the not-too-distant future, but for now I'd just like the get the darn thing running.

Lemme start over . . . .

Reply #14 – August 14, 2011, 03:59:14 PM

Also Tom, with the key in the "on" position and my test light connected between the "I" spade and the "I" (green) wire, I get nothing.