Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Topic: Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures (Read 1735 times) previous topic - next topic

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

July 06, 2007, 03:22:13 PM

It's about time someone held these guys accountable for their inflated hybrid milage claims that never make the street. I'm just surprised it happened to Honda before Toyota and their great lie HSD.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070706/AUTO01/707060350/1148

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #1 – July 06, 2007, 03:43:37 PM

Quote

49/51 mpg figures are EPA's

Honda and others note that EPA tests, which hadn't been revised in two decades, have overstated average fuel economy for all vehicles. Last year, the EPA announced it was revising its testing procedures to better reflect real world driving conditions, beginning with the 2008 model year.

Of course the claim is Honda advertised these figures knowing full well they were not attainable... Ought to be interesting...

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #2 – July 06, 2007, 08:21:45 PM

Kinda ironic how our 20-year-old American iron routinely achieves the EPA estimates and then some...

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #3 – July 06, 2007, 08:22:02 PM

Kinda ironic how our 20-year-old American iron routinely achieves the EPA estimates and then some...

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #4 – July 06, 2007, 08:54:30 PM

Lol right? I've always been happy with the 24mpg I get in the T/A, and before that I was getting about 23 in the Bird.

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #5 – July 06, 2007, 09:36:40 PM

funny how the Honda civic hatchback dx w/5sp manual got 51 mpg....in 1992.

we're going backwards with hybrid tech.

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #6 – July 06, 2007, 09:40:38 PM

I get 24mpg in the Focus! With none of the HP. :(

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #7 – July 06, 2007, 10:01:22 PM

Quote from: HAVI;159061

funny how the Honda civic hatchback dx w/5sp manual got 51 mpg....in 1992.

we're going backwards with hybrid tech.

I know what you mean. You would think by now we could do better... Cars were getting 30 mpg easy in the 80's. In 20 years there is virtually no improvement? Sure the horsepower numbers are bumped up a little now but is that any excuse for the pitiful fuel economy? There must be some sort of "terminal velocity" for fuel efficiency. Either there is a wall we've hit or big oil is afraid of going under.

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #8 – July 06, 2007, 11:24:22 PM

Quote from: amooset;159068

I know what you mean. You would think by now we could do better... Cars were getting 30 mpg easy in the 80's. In 20 years there is virtually no improvement? Sure the horsepower numbers are bumped up a little now but is that any excuse for the pitiful fuel economy? There must be some sort of "terminal velocity" for fuel efficiency. Either there is a wall we've hit or big oil is afraid of going under.

Bumped up "a little"? in the 80's Mustangs were making 225 tops, and Corvettes were making 250. Now there are 500 horse Mustangs and 505-horse Vettes. A 1993 Cobra was rated at 240 horsepower, a 2003 Cobra was rated at 390. V6 Camries and Accords (and now Tauruses/500's) generate considerably more power than 5.0 Mustangs ever did. In the 80's V6 cars were usually in the neighbourhood of 110-150 horsepower. V6 cars now add at least 100 horsepower to that. 4-cylinder econpooopsters make more power than our beloved T-Birds, including Turbo Coupes. That's got a lot to do with the relatively stagnant fuel economy numbers. Imagine what fuel economy would be had modern technology been used to make a 150-horsepower Taurus using a 1.8 liter engine instead of a 263 horsepower Taurus using a 3.5 liter engine...

...Then there's the weight. Remember when our 3500 pound cars were considered heavy? That would be considered light by todays standards. Manufacturers are so concerned with computer controlled headlights, torsional rigidity, power everything, and eleventy-two airbags that every new model weighs much more than the one it replaces.

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #9 – July 06, 2007, 11:35:06 PM

To add to Carmen's post...

Basically it boils down to the fact there is a finite amount of energy(BTUs) in the gasoline and that isn't likely to change... Only way to get more MPG is to have lighter, more aerodynamic vehicles... Or go to a different fuel... My loaded '81 Cutlass Diesel SW would knock out 33 mpg highway all day long... Which was about a mpg better than my stripper 4cyl '76 Stang got...(but I believe the Stang was quicker)...

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #10 – July 07, 2007, 01:11:14 AM

88 TC's were rated 18/27 before the change, now theyre 16/24 i think.

I reset my tripminder when I left for detroit the other day (ether947).
When I got back home I had used 6.0 gallons of gas, it was about 180 miles total, maybe a few more. Thats about 30mpg flat. That included about half of it smooth freeway driving, a lot of slowing down and speeding up freeway driving anywhere from 45 to 75 mph, a little bit of traffic jam, and then a little in town driving. And then ive added maybe 50 more miles on that since then, maybe 60/40 highway/town driving. I was still at 29.8mpg after my last drive. Oh yes, I also have used my AC for about 70% of those miles.

Not sure what my point was there, maybe to prove than you dont need a new car to get good mileage, or that my 19 year old, beat up, old fashioned american iron car gets nearly the same economy as a new fancy puppiesanese hybrid CAR OF TEH FUTARE gets. gg

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #11 – July 07, 2007, 01:37:18 AM

My modded 5.0 HO bird gets 25 highway, 14 city. Yeah it sucks but eh it's got 8 cylinders and a 3.73 gear.

Quote

...Then there's the weight. Remember when our 3500 pound cars were considered heavy? That would be considered light by todays standards. Manufacturers are so concerned with computer controlled headlights, torsional rigidity, power everything, and eleventy-two airbags that every new model weighs much more than the one it replaces.

My point exactly. New cars have a bunch of neat stuff, but it adds a bunch of weight. Late 80's early 90's Civics had a 80 hp engine and weighed 2,000 lbs. Hell my girlfriends parent's new Civic is almost as heavy as my T-bird. Now cars have to have 90,000 toys in them that really aren't necessary and the all have to get to 60 in under 6 seconds or they are hopelessly slow. Remember when you had to get a gas guzzling car to be fast and if you didn't you had a slow car that got good mileage. Perhaps we need to go back to that....

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #12 – July 07, 2007, 03:05:33 AM

My Tbird knocks down mid 20s all day long. Even at its worst, it still stays over 20mpg. Even after making a few passes at the dragstrip, 24-25mpg isn't unheard of. I <3 my Tbird.

I need to see what my mom's 04 4cyl Accord gets mileage-wise. It's pretty quick too.

Carmaker sued for unattainable milage figures

Reply #13 – July 07, 2007, 04:10:17 AM

My yellow cat was getting 23+ on the highway, that was w/AOD and 4.10's in the rear, maybe my tall 275/50/15's helped in the back a bit. I most likely get better than that now with a 5 speed and 16" tires and rims, and 3:73 in the rear.