I only drove it about ten miles since the alignment is WAY off now, but I simply had to drive it....And MAN, what a difference! I mean, I knew there'd be a difference from replacing worn 19-year old suspension parts that were mushy when new with all performance stuff, but holy ! It's like a different car all together! I've always loved driving T-Birds but wished they were a little more "involving" to drive. It always seemed like the car had no connection to the road. Well, NOT ANYMORE!!! The car responds immediately to steering inputs, doesn't roll onto its side when cornering, and stops on a dime (well, a big dime, given the stock 11" TC brakes, but a big improvement over the 10-inchers). It also transmits a good deal more info to the driver - I know exactly what those front wheels are doing now. Unfortunately it also transmits a good deal more road shock & noise, but I can certainly live with that if the car is more fun to drive. It's not too bad anyway - the ride actually reminds me of a first gen Acura Integra coupe (just much, much heavier). That's a good thing though - the car just feels so ed much more precise than it ever did. Hell, the car just feels like it lost about a thousand pounds. I know it didn't, but it doesn't wallow like it used to...
I can only imagine how much better it'll be when I get the TC rear and CHE arms in...
Sounds nice. I started at the back with the TC rear and CHE arms, I'm waiting to install the 2003 Cobra Arms, 11" spindles & brakes & new struts as a unit. I imagine the car will be rather tight when complete :D
welcome to the club of performance tbirds lol. i couldnt beleve the difference in handeling eather at first. but ya get used to it, then before you know it you have 13" cobra brakes and a panhard bar lol.
how well paved are the roads up there? around me they are kina py unless they are new. it sucks for the solid rear axle. only reason id consider a IRS setup.
Theres still a lot more you can do to get some improvement also ;)
Oh, I know there's improvement in there - the brakes, f'rinstance. I "upgraded" to what Mustang guys throw away :D Some day it will get bigger brakes, but I'm in no hurry - going from 10" to 11" made a world of difference. I imagine it'll stop even better when the rear discs are in. Handling will likely improve when the SFC's are in as well - the front half is stiff, the rear half will soon be stiff, but everything in between is jello :hick: The car could also stand to lose about 500 pounds, though I think it's relatively light for an 88 anyway (few options). I don't know if I wanna ditch the insulation tho - with the stiffer ride it could probably use the deadening.
Some day way in the future I may attempt the IRS thing (it'll never be a drag car, so I am not so much concerned with hooking on a track), and since that would pretty much dictate 5-lugs I'll probably buckle and do the Cobra brake thing as well, but that's a looooong way off!
Question: With the CHE arms will the quad shocks be necessary? I doubt it, since most models came without 'em anyway (and those cars have spongy suspensions), but if they'll actually do something I'll install 'em. The ones on the parts TC don't look too good, so I'd have to get new ones - will Mustang ones work?
Nate: The roads here are shameful, but the car will probably see less than 1000 miles anually anyway. Hell, I've only put 3k on it since October, and most of those were put on while the Volvo was down, and while moving (towing a trailer back & forth - the 'Bird has a hitch while the Volvo is not so equipped). I'll be replacing the Dakota with another truck before deer season, so the 'Bird is strictly "pleasure only"
Oh, BTW, the TC springs brought the front end down just the perfect amount. I am almost tempted to think the parts TC had lowering springs, since it sat lower that my V8 car front and rear. Of course it could just have the oh-so-common "Sag Arse" that afflicts these vehicles... The V8 car sits with a nice "rake" right now, but that should go away (or be significantly reduced) with the TC rear springs.
I'll post a pic tomorrow of the new stance
beautifull!
yep, another kick in the nuts for selling my car/stuff....
im so excited for you man, must be quite the feeling!
I actually found the CHE arms to slightly soften the ride out back, but give tighter control. Don't know if that makes sense to you but that's how it felt to me. I kept the quads on because, honestly, they really do make a difference to me. If I take them off the side-to-side handling turns to mush, CHE arms or not. Then again...I sort of have a much different situation than everyone else here. 4000 lbs of car + 260 lbs. of me + no roof on car = a bit of body roll. ;)
Anyway, glad to hear it's back on the ground and rollin' Carm. That's got to be a great feeling! If you decide to use the quads, Mustang shocks are identical. You have to use the T-Bird brackets since the framerails are different back there vs. the Mustang.
Is this using used TC Struts up front, or an aftermarket performance upgrade?
So how much did you have to use that new cutting torch to get that front end apart.
Hope you enjoy the fruits of your labour. If your cheep like me, you could attempt to do a quick redneck front end alignment, with some jackstands, fishing line, and a metal strait edge.
It's using the Munroe Sens-A-Tracs that I bought from Ether947. They had less than a thousand miles on 'em when I bought 'em from him. I know there would probably be more improvement using aftermarket performance struts, but not right now...
I did not use the torches at all (no bottles yet, something I hope to cure very soon). The car actually came apart quite well except the one control arm bolt was stubborn (seized to the spacer inside the bushing - took me two hours to extract it, but it came out intact) and the right tie rod end was stubborn (twisted it like liquorice). The only thing I used heat for was a propane torch to burn the old bushings out of the control arms.
The alignment will be free (and performed by me). We have an alignment machine at work.
Eric: Since I have the parts car I'll remove the quad shock brackets and hold on to 'em. If I decide I want em I'll put some on.
On a sad note, that poor ol' parts TC is looking pretty bare now - the only good parts still on it are the rear end and one window (the backlight), and I'll be getting them very soon. The doors, fenders, hood, bumper covers, trunklid, interior, drivetrain, and suspension have all been pilfered. 'Tis merely a shell of its former self now. I felt bad about tearing up a TC, but it had terminal rust (very much like, and in the same places as Ether947's TC). I'll feel really bad after I get those last few parts - the guy that's storing it for me is into s metal and is gonna burn the dash out of it to get the copper, and then will then crush it with his front end loader and put the carcass on his s pile (in fact, to facilitate removal of the rear end I'll be having him flip it upside down with the loader). I'll feel so bad, in fact, that I'll be sure to get pics :D
That's it, I've decided. All my winter fix-up money is going into my car's suspension.
Carm, one suggestion i have to you, is when you align it, set yourself up with about 1-1.5* negative camber. This is for when you corner, youll have a bit of body roll, and it will allow the outside tire to sit "flat" on the road. Basically giving you all the contact patch possible.
Since you wont be driving it much, it shouldnt be an issue on your tires.
I will be dialing in some negative camber for sure (well, as much as the stock strut mounts will allow. I didn't bother with C/C plates yet). The last set of tires lasted about 15k miles before the outside edges were worn down, so anything to take some heat off them should help.
Ok now my car has something else added to the to do list. You're making me want to change my 19 year old suspension bushings. So my list is now:
1. fix interior up (in the process)
2. Re-paint car
3. put in a 5.0 HO
4. suspension upgrade and 11" brake conversion.
I'm going to have a busy 2 or 3 years:D
I would swap those last two if I were you, unless you have an engine that's really on its way out. Even with a stock 5.0 with bumped timing and a 3.73 rear end my car is hard to keep on the road if you're moving at any rate of speed. I'd rather have the car be sure-footed before I drive lead-footed.
That's why I did the suspension first. Before I put any kind of power into this car I want it to be able to handle it...
You guys took the words out of my mouth. No point in putting 200 horses to the ground if you can't keep them there, right?
You meant to say 400 didn't you?
;)
Not unless thunderjet302 changes step 3:
:D
Hah! I'd be happy if my car put down 100 at the wheels. It's probably more like 75.
Hmm the mustang ones were shorter then my 87 t/c quads.
:D Mmmm 400....
I certainly know about those suspension issues. I've got the CHE's and a slightly stiffened front, plus some SFC. What a word of difference from stock...
I wasn't going to say anything....
Over on nato someone has the part number for a steering stabalizer that fits into the bracket nicely.