So I've been looking around lately, being that I originally wanted to get a 5.0 Mustang after I graduate, and just seeing what prices are. All I can say is- ouch! Seems like even py 5.0's go for $3,500-4000. Whilst browsing these mustangs on Autotrader, I looked through Thunderbirds as well. I saw one cherry '88 5.0 Thunderbird on there for $2900, and it got me to thinking. I know I could pick up a V8 thunderbird for considerably less than a Mustang would probably cost me. So I'm curious as to what the ups and downs of these cars are?
I already know a couple, such as-
150 hp from the factory
Auto trans only
7.5" rear
But at the same time, being Fox based, I know that pretty much all the "good stuff" from a Mustang will bolt right on.
So, I'm wondering as to what the other pluses, minuses and oddities of these cars might be. And how hard is it to swap in a 5 speed?
5 speed swaps are easy...done 3-4 of them.
Power is easy to add....same as a Mustang
They weigh a bit more, but are alot nicer inside.
Certain "restoration" parts are hard (if not impossible) to come by.
A big plus is they're not Mustangs.....
ride nicer, the v8 tbirds swap that ho in, in less than a few hrs because its a direct swap with computer. and they are longer and wider which if im not mistaken is better for handeling and more stable go'n down the track.
The list is actually endles but here are a few.
1. Can swap the 5-speed in
2. Can do the HO swap
3. Supercharger or Turbo off of a Mustang will fit
4. Can use the 94-98 Mustang suspension parts for an upgrade
5. They have more room then a Mustang so trips with your modded Thunderbird/Cougar are alot less stressfull
6. And everyone has a Mustang......do something different.
The list goes on and on, use your imagination.
Thanks,
Chris
Didn't the 88 sport model birds come with an 8.8 Trac-lock? Or was that only the XR7's?
cougars in 88 if it was a 5.0 got the 8.8 if im not mistaken
yeah only the xr7 cougars got the 8.8, still didnt have much gear in it tho. i also forgot to say the sub frame in our cars is heavyer than mustangs. when i compaired mine to my friends 91 gt, his is considerably smaller. like instead of being a 4x4" box, its like a 4x2" rectangle. and if it matters, i think we have a bigger gas tank mustangs are something like 15 and ours are like 22 for v8s
That's kinda a dicy question. Officially, only the Turbo Coupe and XR7 had the traction-lock 8.8", but it seems a few Sports snuck out of the factory with it toward the end of the '88 model year
I thought all '87-88 Thunderbirds/cougars had the same size gas tank. I know Mustangs had a 15.7 gallon tank, and tbird/cougar tanks are around 20 gallons. I know the one in my turbo coupe is at least 20 gallons because if I run it down to 1/4 tank, it takes around 16 gallons to fill.
T birds and cougars are cheaper to get. cost same as stang to do up. Cheaper on insurance then a stang and best off all they get looked over by cops and stang owners as nothing.
How can you beat having a sleeper
cheaper
better forums (joke)
easy to upgrade.(the 150hp isnt as "bad" as everyone says, I can spin the tire easy up to 20 or so on both my 86 v-8's. for a old car, it isnt to bad)
most mustang parts bolt on.
lots of inside room, maybe not as much as a 4 door, but not bad at all. I am 6'4", and I fit fine. I usally have more then enough room. People that sit in the back hate me, but I am fine.
the cops look right over you thing is true too.
Think light cheap crownvic with mustang parts, and your about there.
The parts compatability is worth it alone. You can go onto mustang forums, take some of their old parts, and have cheap upgrades for your own car. Theres also a ton of factory parts you can use to upgrade your bird.
My 3.8L bird was just a base model with a lighting options group. I went through junkyards, put an buttstuffog gauge cluster in it, TC seats, a full console, a floor shifter, and a bunch of odds and ends in the interior, and had a really nice, clean looking interior, that didnt have that jumbled up aftermarket look, and was almost exactly what i wanted. Went and i got turbo coupe swaybars, and put some 15" turbines on it, tc header panel, tempo mirrors, did some paint work, and have an eye catching car that ive never heard anyone badmouth other than for being a 3.8L, even stang guys.
I was able to mix and match untill i came up with something i liked, we have a lot of options in that respect.
The only down side I see has only started as of late. Due to the fact that not as many people are Cougar/Tbird enthusiasts as compared to Mustang enthusiasts and the fact that they are fairly inexpensive AND well built make a good combo for Junior's first car. That being said I loved my first car but, could have been a lot nicer to it and compared to other people I have seen/know I really don't think I was all that bad. It's just getting hard to find a good platform to start with.
One of the best things... you don't get labeled as having that typical Mustang asshole attitude.
If they weren't too expensive when I was looking for a car, I may have been one of them.
There are too many others to even list. They're just cooler than Mustangs.
*EDIT* Sorry if I offended anyone here who owns a Mustang.*
I like mine alot. Like Haystack said the 5.0 SO ain't that bad. I've added 3.73 gears and a Traction Lock, Stang shorties and custom 2.25 dual exhaust, a HO upper throttle body, and a FMS 1/2" heat spacer to mine. My guess is the car now has 170-180 hp and 280-290 ft/lbs torque. Car accelerates pretty good and can pass most any normal family car on the road. Handeling could be better but mine is an LX so that's probibly why. I'm adding new endlinks and bushings up front and a Turbo Coupe sway bar out back which should help alot. In my opinion they are much better looking than a 5.0 Mustang and can be made to run as fast, if not faster than one. Plus it actually draws attention when I go to car shows. More so than a 5.0 Mustang cause no one has these cars anymore. Stay away from the 3.8 V6 ones though. I drove an 88 3.8 with 37,000 miles on it (that's right 37,000 NOT 137,000 car was mint. Wish I would have bought it instead of my Buick:screwy: as a daily driver) and the car was a turd. Even with the more powerful 88 engine the car couldn't hold a candle to my 5.0 Bird and that was before I modded my car!
If I bought a 3.8 car, the only reason would be to have a car to swap a V8 into.
I guess I'll have to look around here and see what I can find. Seems like most birds & cougars people have around here are clapped-out V6 cars that they're using as a beater.
I have to admit, I love mustangs, but I've gained quite a fondness for my Thunderbird since buying it, and I always loved the lines of the Thunderbirds. I wanted to buy a Turbo Coupe when I was in high school but my dad wouldn't let me, in 2003 I finally got one and I've never regretted the decision to buy it. But I'm hankerin' for something with a V8 (I have never driven a car of any sort with a V8 in it. How deprived am I? :mad: )
And I also know what you guys mean about just another Mustang...when I go out to WFC and there's 200 Fox mustangs in the show...after awhile you just start to walk past them without even looking because there isn't much to see that you haven't already.
My wife has no idea why anybody would like Cougars (or T-Birds) so much. I tell her it's an acquired taste. I also tell her it's a poor man's Mustang. She says she'll never ride in mine (assuming I ever get it on the road). Now I love Mustangs to death (more so the '67 to '70's), but the Fox Mustangs do get old after a while. She and I had a '99 V6 Stang for about a year until we figured out that it would never be a family car, which we needed worse than a sporty car. Now she wants an '05 GT. I guess there are worse things to have than a wife who shares your love of Mustangs. But I don't think I'll ever make her like my Cougar. I myself think that the '83/'86 Cougar/Bird still has some of the coolest lines of any car made since the '60's/'70's, and even though they built a million of them in their day, there just aren't that many still on the road.
Fordman3
Ya know, there are qualified hypnotists out there that can help you out ;)
Someone said something about a 5.0 Bird/Cougar for a high school kid. It's a good thing I didn't have this car in high school...I would have killed myself. I drove slant sixes(all 90bhp worth, old Mopars :yuck: ) and a Ford truck with a 4.9 straight six. I somehow managed to almost kill myself in both those vehicles. These cars shouldn't be in the hands of h/s kids unless they are incredibly responsible(IMO). It would be ashame to see another Bird/Coug to get smashed up.
I know what you mean, I drove a '90 2.3L Mustang in high school. Even 88 hp in a near 3000 lb car is enough to get you into trouble! It was in that car that I found out how to do clutch dumps, and also took a turn too fast once and bounced off the guardrail after almost going into a ditch. oops.
I took out a fire hydrant in my car when I was 16.
Wow, I've had my cougar since I was 16. I didn't come close to hurting myself once. One time though I did punch it while making a left turn from a stop sign. It got a little sidways which got enough of my attention that I never did it again. But really, I loved and still love my car too much to take chances.
Taking chances is half the fun.
Yes, only if you're an experienced driver and know your vehicle like that back of you hand.
Good to see some people were responsible drivers in high school...lol.
You will never know your vehicle like the back of your hand unless you push, and exceed its limits.
Man I am with everyone on the reasons to have a T-bird over a 'stang. Where I live you either have a truck or a Mustang. I've been slowly working on my car for the last year and have a long way to go but I think I'll have something unique when I'm done. A lot of people have been judgemental about my decision to modify "an old T-bird" but they all drive clones of what everyone else has (a Chevy truck with a lift kit and identical wheels to everyone else, etc.) so I like the fact that when I cruise through town chances are I'll have the only fixed up T-bird. I've had my car since I was 17. Too tell you the truth it is a lot of car for an inexperienced driver...but nothing compared to those who were in high school during the muscle car era. Can you imagine having a 400 hp muscle car at 18 yrs old! P.S. I did wreck my car once while drag racing lol. Anyway go for it man...to heck with 5.0 Stangs.
Makes me miss my first car.
Hell, I'm still not a responsible driver.
There really aren't many Mustangs around here (except bone stock '95 and up V6's). It's very rare that I see a V8 Mustang that's actually had much of anything done to it, much less a nice Fox. I never figured that out. Here it's sorta like 50tbrd said, everyone has either a truck with a lift and loud-ass "dools", or a riced out import (or just some POS with a ler on it). I always hear from people how "everyone and their brother has a Fox 5.0" but that sure doesn't apply here.
Even a V6 can do the work done well. I had two cougars 3.8 and both lived until we crashed them. The first lived at least 11 years still strong. Mine lived nearly 4 years, maybe more if i want. The V8 will be a very good car.....totally recommended...
Yeah I just meant Mustangs in general. There really are very few 5.0 fox's around...kinda like fox body T-birds/Cougars most of them got the beat out of them and are now in the boneyard or in some cases Bubba's back yard on blocks. For the most part people drive 94 up V6's and some V8's. A buddy of mine has a '94 Cobra. The real majority are pickups though...
Well to be fair, the raod I was on is usally empty and has a 25mph speed limit which I was doing. I swerved to miss a wreck coming around a blind corner and hit the firehydrant (sideways, the car has 95%(no quess, saftey paper said so, less then 1% away from not passing) braking power in the front, gotta fix that one of these days) oh yeah and its was raining really bad too.
People hate me cause I go the speed limit and give myself room to stop, I aint no saint all the time though.
I've never driven anything but V8 Cougars. Well there was that one time when I lost my way and purchased a '90 XR7 with the 3.8 SC motor in it but I soon realized the error of my ways and am now happily back in a Fox.
I think a lot of people do not realize the potential of these cars. Most of the Cougars and 'Birds that they see are beaters full of rust or never washed or otherwise taken care of. So it catches them off guard to see one that's really nice. I had a 20th anniversary Cougar that was immaculate with only 60,000 miles on it. Everywhere I went I got compliments on that car. Some people didn't even realize it was a Cougar at first. I guess the shiny paint and lack of rust threw them off. ;)
Ain't this good enough to make you want a Bird???
(http://www.members.pen 15s.net/turbocoupe50/tc50nov05.jpg)
Don't look bad shined up a little either....
(http://www.members.pen 15s.net/turbocoupe50/tc04.jpg)
As far as never knowing your cars limits unless you test them...well I have, and I still do occasionally. I just make sure that I'm in an area where there is no chance of hitting anything, no curbs and no other traffic. I feel confident now that in any given situation I could avoid an accident, or at the least, minimize the damage.
As far as T-bird/Coug over 'Stang....oh yeah, any day of the week.
I have had stangs and cougars,
Its easyer to make stang faster right off the bat but anything you do to stang u can do to T bird cougar. I find ride is better in T birds and you have more space inside.
So i rather have bigger car and build it up just as good
And your car sounds sweet as hell too, Tom! Thats all I needed to hear for alot of insperation!:D
Even with the Special Edition having so many ugly spots (no rust though) I get people stopping to talk to me about it all the time. Every couple of times I'm at the gas station someone goes "hey I had one of those, best car I ever owned, should have never sold it". People who don't know anything about the Cougar stop and mention how much the rear windows caught there eye. No one has ever told me they didn't like the car. Even my picky little sister wanted my car after riding in it once.
I know you mentioned a t bird but it holds the same charachter as the cougar I think.
The only minus I see to buying a fox bird is having to swap motors to bring it up to mustang speed. But thats easy enough.
yeah, I got pulled over and the cop asked me what kinda car i was in. Some people are just so thrown off by the back windows.
Hell even 5.0 Fox Stangs are getting to the age where you should probibly pull the engine to freshen it so it's not too big a deal. My 5.0 has about 125,000 on it and runs strong but if I'm going to go through the trouble to upgrade the engine I might as well change the bearings, rings ect. So either way most 5.0s have high milage so pulling the engine probibly should be done even if it's a Stang. I'de rather rebuild the bottom end before adding all the stuff and finding I have a oil burining issue or worse;) .
I think you took the only minus to owning a 5.0 bird and proved it a moot point!
So we have it
You have no negatives to owning a bird!
Well at least I have one disciple following me down the Tbird path of richeousness...
Rob you are saved(from driving some bland riceburner)... :rollin:
Who wouldn't want a blown 5L Cougar?
:bowdown:
I've got every Mustang part you can imagine on the car or waiting to be installed.
(http://home.comcast.net/~ktf23t/wsb/media/52931/site1049.JPG)
Well, I kinda knew that already... :tg: