Hello, I haven't posted in awhile as life is in the way. Long and short is that I want to actually drive my Tbird and with the c4 in it its a bit of a bear.
So trans options
AOD
4r70w
T-5
or
M5R2 5-speed
I have the M5R2 5-speed, and the 4r70w but the the auto would need a tail swap and a rebuild (out of a 4wd explorer) as well as a full manual vb which is like 500 dollars.
The M5R2 5-speed is in the trunk of a SC that a road grater smashed and I believe is good, we didn't get a chance to drive the car before we sold the motor out of it. I can get the clutch stuff of this car or I have another TC that was a stick to nab the parts off of.
T-5 and AOD I would end up buying. I have a couple of cores I could rebuild an AOD from and eat my shift has super rebuild kits for around 775.
SO if you owned my car which route would you go, I'm torn between stick and auto as I'm in alot of stop in go traffic and my leg gets tired (don't mind manual vb trans as that is what I have now.) Car is in my sig below, only new thing since then is addition of Mass-Flo system on car. I'm leaning more towards the auto, but price is a factor as well. If it costs the same for a reliable stick vs auto then I'd just assume to go lazy left leg. And there is a blower in the future for my car so I want something that will hold up hopefully.
I would go either a built aod, or the 4r70w, both good trannies when built properly. :)
From what I seen it will be cheaper to go the AOD vs 4r70w route, would need full manual vb for the 4r70w and that thing is like 500 bucks. The detent cable is the only snag I see so far, don't have a spot to hook it on my TB so will have to fab something.
As for the trans out of the super coupe, I never heard of people useing these before. Are they pretty tough? Will it hold up as it is or do I need to go through it and upgrade parts of it?
If its pretty stout I might put it in now and save up for a dart block and replace the trans later.
To build an AOD the right way and get a good converter (ie Dirt Dog or Precision Industries) is going to cost in excess of about $2.5K. It's really the only way an AOD is going to live behind that 331 though.
Check the below kit, I think only thing it would need extra is a hardened input shaft.
http://monstertrans.com/store/products/AOD-SS-Mega-Monster-Transmission-Complete-Rebuild-Kit%3A-1983%252d89.html
i've seen stock SC 5 speeds handling 450rwhp.. i'd throw the AOD idea in the garbage.. if you're looking to build a dart block, that means you're going to go after more power than a stock block can handle.. if that's the case, an AOD is going to cost more than you're really going to want to spend to build a trans.. my vote goes for the 4r70w if you want an auto or doing some research over on SCCoA for the M5R2.. my final vote, if the research proves the M5R2 is as good as i believe it to be, than i say go 5 speed.. stick is more fun to drive, in my opinion
I like grabbing gears, hate mashing clutch in traffic. And for more power, yes. I'm some where north of 425 horse now (pretty sure any way), and thinking a cam change and blower are in my future. Undecided if I need to swap heads yet or not.
Will go check out s'more on the sc 5 speed. Also will look more into a 4r70w, I haven't rebuilt a trans other than a c4 before, and even then it was with some one holding my hand.
I appreciate the input guys.
I don't believe the M5R2 interchanges with a fox body, something about the shifter being in the wrong spot. Same reason the MN12 guys don't swap T5's. I could be wrong.
shifter placement looks relatively the same, but it really depends on the actual length of both transmissions.. i never really considered using the M5R2 behind a small block, because i never really knew the 3.8 bellhousing was the same.. so i don't know any of the measurements
the M5R2
(http://www.tccoa.com/articles/mn12how-to/m5r2_rebuild/m5r2-side-view.JPG)
T5
(http://carburetor-manual.com/images/31_1_b.jpg)
Its been awhile since I laid eyes on it but the M5R2 was HUGE I thought, as in big around. I don't have a t5 laying about either :(.
it's not that much bigger than the T5.. usually, it just looks that way, because the bellhousing doesn't separate lol.. if i had either laying around, i'd help you out with some measurements.. but alas, i don't
They blow up behind 300's, can't handle the torque. Supercoupe guys are basically stuck with them. All have truck gear ratio's.
Gotta pay to play. I would run a beefed up t-5 or a toploader. Toploaders are reletively cheap, and hold up to a lot of power.
They blow up behind 300's, can't handle the torque. Supercoupe guys are basically stuck with them. All have truck gear ratio's.
Gotta pay to play. I would run a beefed up t-5 or a toploader. Toploaders are reletively cheap, and hold up to a lot of power.
Sweet Jesus why are manual trans so expensive? I thought manual vs auto that the manual would be cheaper. Seems a built 4r70w or AOD is a bit cheaper then a t5 or t56.
T5 gforce gears 1200, plus 300 for rebuilt kit, or buy one for around 19-2400.
AOD 795 for SS kit from monster trans + 300 for hardened input shaft from Broader or 1400-2200 for built one.
4r70w 1900-2200 from broader with full manual VB (I think by far the best choice for handleing abuse)
Looks like I'll probably go 4r70w, with t5 trailing. I can use my ratchet shifter I have now with the 4r70w and less work.
Well I appreciate everyone's feed back, I'm still open to oppinions as it will be awhile b4 I do a swap.
Manuals are cheaper, if you have a core. They also last longer if there taken care of, making cores harder to get.
I got a JY 4R70 trans and added a controller. $700.00 plus fluid. LOVE it......and I've always been a manual guy.
The only downer on the 4r70w I have is that its a 4x4 and I don't have a AODE or 4r70w to rob the output or tail housing. I think I can get those for around 100 dollars total. The trans is supposed to be good but I'd have to pull apart to change output shaft so might as well rebuild and I can't seem to find parts for it like you do for the AOD. I can build a pretty stout AOD for about 1700, steel drum, new bands, new clutches and steels, new 1 piece output shaft, billet servo, one piece input shaft, valve body, and 10' billet convertor (from broader performance). Or can just get standard rebuild and VB for the 4r70w for probably around 1k-1200 plus cost of tail and convertor.
I picked my car up with a toasted AOD, and the auto trans guy in my shop and I (the man is a Ford Senior Master, and a genius) transplanted most of a 4R70W stack into it and left the AOD valve body alone. I've effectively installed the old wide ratio kit and added at least 1 clutch and 1 steel to every clutch pack, and upgraded to steel parts in place of cast iron and uped the OD band to 2 inches. I've been running it for 4 months and I love it. AOD cores are cheap, and if you've already got a 4R70W, I'd go that way. I love mine. With some fill rate mods in the VB, I should be good for 450 HP. Now on to the halfway burnt HO engine...
Thanks for the info, I've seen lots of combo's like the 4r70w put into a AOD. Its going to be my first Overdrive auto rebuild so I'll see how it goes.
For the 4r70w into the AOD swap, you use the input and output shaft of the 4r70w right? Reason I ask that is one of the main weak points of the AOD. I found I can build a completely bullet proof AOD with billet 10" convertor for 1750. Thats upgrading all the cast to steel parts.