Fox T-Bird/Cougar Forums

ok so first off hi my names Brian i'm new to this site and have a 86 Thunderbird with a 3.8 v6. what i would like to do is swap from 4 lug to 5 lug and was wondering what i'd need to do and whats the least expensive or best way to go, i say least expensive because i am a collage student and don't have lots of funds laying around haha so i wouldn't mind going to the junk and piecing it together or saving up for maybe a kit any info would help me out thanks :D

welcome..... have you done a search? there's lots of info on here to be found.

Give me your car. I'll give you a cool Mustang that (most) everyone wants...cauz Mustangs R teh cooool. ;)

Yeah,  :jerry:
:rollin:

@ daminc ive seen alot of posts but im still not clear on it all. i need some one to giive me a run down of like the parts list i would need like what i would need or look for at the junk or online

and @ ThunderbirdSport302 na im good haha i like my thunderchicken hahaha

http://www.coolcats.net/modifying/4to5lug.html

Basically the same as any other mustang, as long as you remember axles are slightly wider on our cars.

for my 5 lug swap..I used '94-'95 spindles that a guy here got for me (Thanks Vinnie!), struts from I think the same car (bought them earlier, thanks again Vinnie!) and then I sourced locally the calipers, pads and new rotors.

For the rear (still waiting to get the stuff) I'm going to use Mark VII axles and the brake parts from that. One can use 2 passenger Ranger axles, but then you'll have a narrower track width than before. The Ranger axles work better for Mustangs as the width before and after is very similar. The mark 7 setup is a hair wider than a stock '86-'88 Tbird setup, so that's why I'm going that route. I want the same size wheels with the same backspacing at all corners.

Now keep in mind, you CAN use the 94-'98 Mustang axles, as well as the Ranger stuff, and use wheels with less backspace to make up the difference, at the cost of not being able to rotate tires from front to rear....

Also the '94-'98 Stangs only have solid rotors...the Mark 7 has vented. (rears)

You can run wheel spacers on the rear to be able to rotate tires.

True enough...but...

Wh

Folks have over-looked the fact that he has an '86 with the odd-ball (wider) 7.5 housing.  I don't think anyone has posted up a 5-lug drum brake solution for one of those yet. (He said he was looking for "cheap", so the assumption is that a rear disc conversion is out)

You're right, Chuck. Perhaps I need to look at the axle/rear end chart again to refresh my memory. :)

well if i can piece it together with time i would go with disk all around and just get it together little by little. but will my rear have to be different or can i go with mark vii's like ThunderbirdSport302?

and also thanks every one for helping me out really appreciate it.

Mark 7 is about 3/4" wider then your rear end. If you want to put wider tires on it later, they will be very close to the fender lip. The 94-98 mustang rear is the same between v-6 and gt models, and is very close in length, and basically should bolt in other then brake line adaptars. The 99-04's were even wider, and probably similar length to the mark7 rear.

I have heard the 90-95 explorers had 9 and 10" drum s in 5 lug, that had a wider hat then the rangers, but I still haven't seen mesurments.

so i can go with lets say 95 mustang parts all around an it would pretty much bolt right in? if i use 95 rear axles will they still stick out alot or are they closer to what i have now?

'95 stuff would do good...the rears wouldn't be at all stuck out like you see on the late 80's Chevy 4x4's...

If you have the funds, throw in a set of 3.55 or even 3.73 gears in that punkin before you put it all in...

sweeet! :D oh and for the rear axles i was looking online and they show that there are to different kind there are 31 spindle and 28 spindle axles which ones do i need or will both fit in?

whats a rough price range will the gears run me?

No Fox or SN95 Stang ever had 31 spline axles factory..the trucks did...the F series.

If you can find a V8 '95..it will have the 8.8, the V6 cars had a 7.5, but the axle shafts themselves are identical, regardless of the rear end housing. Same with the front end parts, spindles, calipers, rotors, etc, are identical, whenther 3.8 or 5.0/4.6 ('94-'98) Although ideally you'd want '94-'95 stuff.

I just swapped in 5 lugs axles this weekend.  From a 95 i believe.  Slipped right in.  I bought some new stock rotors and had a machine shop redrill them to fit the 5 lug pattern. As a note WATCH THAT THE SPIDER GEARS DONT POP OUT!

Again, you have an 8.8, not the 7.5 he has. 

Axle Spreadsheet (http://"www.griffshp.com/belchja/forums/axledata.xls")

Look at the chart, read the numbers. 

The 94-98 Mustang axles MAY work in his wider 7.5 HOUSING, but it all depends on the location of the bearing surfaces on the axles.  His housing is 1.5" wider(3/4" per side) than the 87-88TC 8.8, All the Fox Mustang 7.5/8.8, and all the 94-98 Mustang 7.5/8.8.

A COMPLETE rear axle assembly from a 94-98 Mustang (7.5 or 8.8) will be the same overall width as his current 7.5, but he would need to deal with the disk brake conversion.

As mentioned, as far as I can remember, no one has come up with a 5-lug drum brake solution for the wider 86-88 7.5 housing.  I know Gumby was messing with it, but I don't know where that wound up.

ok so i would need something like this Chuck?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/94-95-1994-1995-MUSTANG-SVT-COBRA-8-8-DISC-BRAKE-REAR-AXLE-END-3-08-11-65-BRAKES-/120844927855?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item1c22eb436f#ht_10460wt_1037

ok so i would need something like this Chuck?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/94-95-1994-1995-MUSTANG-SVT-COBRA-8-8-DISC-BRAKE-REAR-AXLE-END-3-08-11-65-BRAKES-/120844927855?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item1c22eb436f#ht_10460wt_1037

Yes, it will fit as I mentioned above.  You'd need to use your control arms.

Obviously best to try and find something local to you, and not on the other coast.

ok awesome thanks evry1 for your help now i got a good understanding of what i need n a rough price range :D

Dang... Since I live in the "other" LA  I was going to try and sell him the pieces I've got in storage, since the car is gone I kinda don't need them. ;)

I have some bookmarks that may help. I'll start with this one and see what else I can find. I've been contemplating this swap for my 84 but I haven't found any 5 bolt wheels yet that I'm willing to replace my cobra ones with.

http://www.mustangcentral.net/tech/5lug.html


EDIT:....found another one which may be of some use for information at least.

http://sbftech.com/index.php/topic,2681.0.html

Your 84 is a different beast than his 86 in regards to the rear axle. Nothing posted that's for a Fox Mustang will work for the rear of his car.

The numbers are there in the chart I linked and the couple caveats I mentioned.

I stand corrected. I was understanding that the 84, 85, and 86 used the same components. I posted the links as a different point of view with a little more info as I like to find as much info as possible prior to a project so as not to second guess myself when it's done.

As has been discussed at length here, the 7.5 housing used in the 85.5-88 cars is wider than the earlier ones.  Again, the chart I linked has the numbers for you. 

Your 84 has the narrower "Mustang" housing, and will accept any of the 94-98 5-lug Mustang axles.

ok i got another question about the rear, i found a guy localy with a complete rear end and he says it has 3.27 gears, now i dont kno what my stock gears are and i was wondering if this would work with my car or if i would have to change the gears or something thanks.

3.27's are an improvement over what you have now...if it's an 8.8 and for sure 3.27's I'd have no problem snagging it up.

If you can see the rear in person, spin one axle end by hand, and watch the driveshaft yoke. If it rotates 3 and 1/4 times roughly to one complete turn of the axle end, it's a 3.27 ratio, and bonus points if it's a Trac Loc.

Any idea on what it's from? Some mark VII's had 3.27 8.8 rears...I *think*.

says its a sn95 rear end with 3.27 gears that's all i know right now haven't had the funds yet waiting for taxes :D

Hi guys, I just joined the board after finding this thread. I have an '86 3.8 Bird as well and have been researching my options. I was wondering if the OP ever completed his swap?

Will Mark VII (non ABS) rotors bolt directly to the front of a 1988 T-Bird (3.8L)? If so, what year rotors? Thanks.

No, they will not fit. You'd have to go to Turbo Coupe or Mustang 5.0 front brakes first. There is a company, and I forgot who they were, that actually sell rotors for your car that are 5 lug. I'll see what I can find.

Vinnie may be thinking of this place:
 
http://completebrakeservice.com/


 
From Eric's CoolCats site:

Lets see if I can wake this beast of a thread back up. Ive been idly searching for ideas on my build in my free time. This thread seems to have been the most helpful so far. However, I have an 87 Turbo Coupe. My car needs brakes pretty badly. I was going to stick to 4 lug, but I'd prefer bigger brakes. I am getting a little shake during acceleration and deceleration. I know the rotors need to be replaced b/c it shakes hard while braking. I'm a little concerned that the diff may be a source of the shaking. I say all that to say, I think my best bet would be to purchase the whole rear end. My bird is my daily so I cant have it down for too long, but this does give me a little freedom with expenses as I don't have a car payment. My question for you is, If your TC was still untouched, what direction would you go with it? I am about 2 hours away from MPS Auto Salvage previously posted in this thread. They currently have this

http://www.ebay.com/itm/94-95-FORD-MUSTANG-COBRA-8-8-REAR-END-AXLE-NEW-DISC-BRAKE-KIT-5-LUG-11-65/140848895410?_trksid=p2047675.c100012.m1985&_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.DEFAULT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D28772%26meid%3Df81e4832c2524083b9bebdbc881bb312%26pid%3D100012%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D10%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D120844927855

Will this bolt right up? I need to make sure I have everything in place before I break my car down. The last thing I want is to be in a situation where I have to buy or fabricate a bunch of little stuff in the middle of the swap. Thanks for your help!

That'll work but it's way overkill, your rear rotors would be bigger than the front If you go this route. The brake lines have to be tied in to work with the TC and I'm not sure if they bolt right up or if you need adaptors

5-lug is definitely the way to go and you'll want to upgrade the front brakes first, sn95 parts to be specific is what you want for better brakes

If your TC is untouched I would do replace the pads all around, make sure all calipers are working correctly and brakes should be decent, from there I would convert to vacuum assist to get rid of the stock abs unit which will need to be replaced if you plan to upgrade your brakes at all
This consists of mainly a new brake booster, master cylinder, and a proportioning valve. Just these 3 components will make a world of a difference. They really let you get the most out of your stock brake components which are already a big step up from anything non-turbo coupe

Snag a complete rear end out of a V8 94-98 Mustang GT as they have 10.5" rear rotors.  Your current rear end has 10" rotors so the difference in rear breaking will be negligible if you do this part of the brakes first.  The 94-95 rear end is identical to the width of the TC rear from axle  to axle  so where your current wheels sit under the car will not change.  The only issue with just bolting in the 94-98 rear end is that the best your are going to do gear wise if it is a factory unit is 3.27 and the TC's have 3.73's.  To solve that problem you could just swap over the axles and brakes from the 94-98 rear end to the one that is already in the car which if you already have the parts off the 94-98 rear end could be done on a Saturday with no issues.  This has a couple of draw backs though.  The first is that you have to be sure your rear gears, pinion bearing, and carrier bearings are in good shape.  The second is less of a problem but you need to check the axle bearings out on the ends to make sure they are in good shape but the axle seals and bearings are easy to replace with a rental tool from any parts store.  I like to tear my rear ends all the way down, have them media blasted, and then painted black before I put them back in the car but that it just me and by no means 100% necessary.

As for the ABS as mentioned by Ramos617...gut it and do what he said.  I would use a '93 Mustang Cobra booster and master cylinder as this combo will work with your stock brakes, the 94-98 GT brakes, and the Cobra brakes so it gives you a lot of flexibility.  The only draw back is that the Cobra MC has metric threads where the brake lines attach and your car has SAE threads.  To get around this you have two choices which are swap the fittings which can be done several ways but this (http://"http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/MM-MMBAK17/Mustang-Brake-Line-Adapter-94-95-GT-93-Cobra-Master-Cylinder") is stupid simple or install a '85 Lincoln Towncar MC which is aluminum as it has SAE threads but also has a 1" diameter piston like the '93 Cobra MC.

As for the front of the car.  You have a couple of choices to get you to five lug so I will go from cheapest to most expensive.

1) If you have 10" front brakes to begin with you can use mid to late 80's Ranger rotors but I believe you will have to use the races and bearings for your car so they fit the spindles that are on your car.  This is easily checked by looking up the part numbers for the races and bearings for your car and the Ranger.  The draw back here is that you still have 10" brakes and can expect the same shiznitty braking performance.

2) If you have 11" front brakes like the TC's then you can swap over to the Lincoln Mark VII five lug rotors and you are done.  If you have 10" brakes then you will also have to install a set of the TC or 87-93 Mustang 5.0 spindles so that the Mark VII rotors will work.  The larger rotor hat of the Mark VII rotor limits some of the wheels you can use but several like the 97-98 Cobra wheels will work.  So now you will have 11" front brakes but again I still say you will have shiznitty braking performance.  Now that I have said that twice I should explain.  You still have single piston calipers with a not so great slider set up and even if you upgrade to the SVO 73mm front calipers its not all that great.  One draw back of the SVO calipers is that they can hit on some wheels.

3) SN95 Mustang GT front brake conversion on any 83-88 Bird or Cougar.  If you step up to this you will finally have some decent brakes and this should have been what was installed at the factory.  The front brakes on the 94-98 Mustang GT and V6 cars are the same (10.9") so either will work.  For this conversion I usually just go to a salvage yard and tell them that I want a set of 94-95 Mustang GT or V6 spindles (if you are running the stock K-member) or 96-98 Mustang GT or V6 spindles (if you are running an aftermarket tubular K-member) with the dust shields, hubs, calipers, caliper brackets, rotors, strut bolts & nuts, and ball joint nuts.  This usually runs in the $150 to $200 range but I have not bought a setup in a while so its probably changed.  You will also need to get a manual proportioning valve (http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/M2328C/Mustang-Ford-Racing-Adjustable-Brake-Proportioning-Valve) and gut the proportioning side of the combination valve (see picture at the end of the paragraph) and install a new plug in the combination valve (http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/M2450A/Mustang-Brake-Proportioning-Valve-Plug)  From here you have a couple of choices which are taking the rotors down and getting them turned if they will turn or just getting new ones which are fairly cheap and deciding on moving up to the '99-04 Mustang GT calipers which are dual piston PBR calipers.  I would highly recommend that you upgrade to the dual piston PBR's as they increase the braking performance ten fold over the stock 94-98 GT single piston calipers.  This will only require you to remove a small amount of material off the mounting ears of the 94-98 spindles for these to fit (Google this and it will come up all over the Mustang sites and well as on here).  The only other thing you will need to come up with is a 0.330" stack of 5/8" hardened washers for each ball joint so that the castle nut for the spindle is in the right spot.  These washers go between the spindle and the castle nut as the 94-98 spindle is thinner than the Fox spindle at this location.  If you have a car with 10" brakes you can reuse the struts but you will need shims as the distance between the spindle mounting tabs is wider on the 10" brake cars than the 11" brake cars.  The struts from cars with 11" brakes (like the TC's) will bolt directly to the 94-98 Mustang spindles with no shims.

This is what you have to remove from the combination valve.  You will replace the cap with the one I linked from LMRS or where ever you buy it:


4) SN95 Cobra front brake conversion on any 83-88 Bird or Cougar.  Its the same as the Mustang GT brake conversion with the exception of the rotors, calipers, and caliper brackets.  These are different due to the increased rotor diameter to 13" but are still utilizing the same spindle and hub.  I did this upgrade and the GT/V6 dust shields will work just fine with the larger rotors.  If you go this route you need to upgrade the rear brakes to the Cobra specs.  If you have already converted the rear to the 94-98 Mustang brakes then you will need to change the dust shield, rotor, and brake caliper axle bracket, and caliper bracket.  This will require the removal of the axles to swap out the axle brackets.

My 93 Coupe was originally a 4 cylinder car so I drove it with 10" brakes and 9" drums for a couple of years and with the 4 cylinder they sucked so I can only imagine how bad they would have been with a V8.  When I swapped the car over to an injected 5.0 the brakes were "upgraded" to the 11" brakes up front with the SVO calipers and it still sucked.  Later down the road I swapped everything over to the brakes from a 1995 Mustang GT and added the '99 GT front calipers.  It was like lightning had hit the car as it now braked better than anything I had ever owned before and I was very confident in the car.  A few years later I upgraded the car to the Cobra brakes and the braking performance increased but it was not as dramatic as going from the Fox GT brakes to the SN95 GT brakes.  So with all of that said anytime someone is wanting to go to 5 lug my opinion is to skip the Ranger and Mark VII options and go straight to the 94-98 brakes with the '99 GT PBR calipers.

I've read over this a few times. Trying to let it sink in to get some clear direction on what I want to do. I would love to go with the cobra set up, but the parts are probably a lot harder to come by for a decent price. I love the sound of 13" rotors up front. It would be great if I could find a roller. The down side is that I don't have a ton of time to devote to wrenching. Work takes most of that. I've been converting my '84 F-150 to 4bbl since last Feb. I may have a local guy that could do the work for me, while I'm on the road. I just need to get all the parts together and get the whole thing knocked out at once. What I've gathered is that if I want to go Cobra, my brake system would be Cobra parts all the way around. Are the Cobra front calipers dual piston PBR's, and would they require grinding to fit on the spindles? I'm assuming that wouldnt be an issue if I can use the Cobra spindles. What would be the issue with running GT rears with Cobra fronts? When I go with the Cobra set up under the hood, will I be eliminating all forms of ABS?

From what I gather, I need to decide if I'm going all Cobra, or going SN95 with PBR's.

BTW, thank you for your responses. I've been searching the forums for all that info you put in one nice package for me. Also, I believe I'm running a 3.55 gear in my manual TC. Is there a preferred gear for these 2.3 turbos?

Since you already have a 87-88 tc, you already have the best 4 lug braking setup the factory had to offer.

I'd kill the abs  and throw a regular brake booster and master cylinder on and see how you like it. This will need done if you choose to go 5 lug pretty much no matter what. If you still find it inadequate, your not out anything if you decide to do the sn-95 swap later on. You already have 11" front brakes and 10" rear rotors.

The Cobra front calipers and the '99+ calipers are the same in that both are dual caliper setups and both were made by PBR.  The difference is that the Cobras are used with 13" rotors and the '99+ calipers are used with 10.9" rotors.  The will both bolt up to the 99-04 spindles with no modifications.  The Cobra calipers will bolt up to the 94-04 spindles with no modifications however the '99+ calipers require the 94-98 spindles to be modified but will bolt directly to the 99-04 spindles with no modifications.  This is a picture of a '94 spindle showing the two areas that need material removed to fit the '99+ caliper, takes all of five minutes with a 4" grinder and an 80 grit sanding disc:



You need to have a balanced system so running the 13" rotors up front with the 10" rotors out back will be out of whack balance wise.  I drove mine like that for a few months and it prompted me to do the rear a little quicker.

No matter how you look at it the factory brakes on any Fox sucked.  They were horribly under designed and lacking any kind of performance stopping power.  Swapping over to the 94-98 brakes does not increase the rotor sizes from the Fox setup however it does increase the swept area of the brakes and when combined with the '99+ front calipers it will out brake any Fox system hands down.  The other advantage to the SN95 style brakes is that the front hub will fit just about every aftermarket rim out there in five lug where the Mark VII will not.

I can give a glowing endorsp00get for the '99+ dual piston PBR calipers...they rock.

93 Cobra brake booster is a must. I have the SN95 setup in front and MarkVII in the rear, and bias is perfect with a TC prop valve. Don't use spacers between the strut and spindle, use the correct strut. This would be the time for suspension upgrades. LX springs need to go. If you don't want to lower your ride, use sport springs front and rear. LX springs will give quite a nosedive during stopping after the brake upgrade. I had difficulty finding 15 inch wheels that would fit. 16x7s are slim pickens. I had to go with 16x8s, which do stick out of the fender a bit. It actually looks pretty awesome, but I have to watch my speed on certain dips in the road.

I've got the 95 GT master cylinder with the setup listed above. Stopping power is great, however, the pedal seems a little soft. Any suggestions? Darren? My front calipers are SN95. Will going to the 99 PBRs help the pedal feel or make it worse? And also, will the 99 PBRs change the bias?

TC Springs are pretty close to the Sport springs. I had some 2000 Stang GT springs under my Sport, lowered it a bit, and improved the bounciness.

If your pedal is soft, I think you will want to increase the bore...I'm not sure if the '93 Cobra master will be increase in bore size of the '95 master or not. Both cars had disc rear brakes.

The only different in pedal feel I've noticed on my Mustang after the PBR '99+ front caliper swap is that the brake pedal is a bit more touchy than before, it's roughly the same as far as perceived softness or hardness.
Of course I still have the stock drum setup on the rear so that likely doesn't help much.

So I'm looking at getting a 99 mustang gt vert with 17" cobra rims that's in rough shape can I use the rear axle, front spindles and brakes and wheels on my 87 5.0 tbird? I see a bunch of people recommending the 94-98 spindles but I didn't see anything about the 99+

The axles are longer, 99 and up. I'd source some '98-94 axles, myself.

Wheels will be fine, and the spindles will likely need a bump steer kit as the '96+ spindles have raised tie rod mounts.

I'd also suggest '94-'95 spindles for stock height cars, and '96 and up if you're lowering it, or it already is.

Make sure you use those sweet dual piston PBR calipers that are on it, too. Order new flex hoses for a '99 Mustang, and you'll need a Weatherhead fitting #7828, available at most any auto parts store.

I've done the PBR swap, it's easy, uses stock SN95 rotors, but you'll need to grind off a wee bit on the calipers, unless you use the '99 calipers, in which case they're already clearanced.

Chrome,
95 GT MC = 15/16" piston
93 Cobra or 85 Towncar MC = 1" piston

I had a 95 GT MC on my Coupe with the SN95 brakes and it is still on the car with the Cobra brakes.  The Bird has a 95 GT MC with full Cobra brakes and neither have ever had a soft pedal except when I had a little air in the lines on the Coupe.  Maybe you have air in the lines?  I use a power bleeder to get the air out of the lines and I can bleed the system with no help.  I had to do this as the Coupe has the ABS from the 95 GT on it and this is the only way to get all the air out of the system.  This is the power bleeder I use:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mvp-0107 (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mvp-0107)


teal9550,
The spindles off the 99-04 Mustangs are the same as the 96-98 spindles geometry wise but the 99-04 have the clearance to run the 99+ PBR dual piston calipers.  The 99+ rear ends are physically different than the 86-93 and 94-98 rear ends in both housing length and axle length.  The 94-98 rear ends are a bolt in to the Birds and Cougars axle  to axle  as far as I know so I tend to recommend that setup for those moving to five lug and disc brakes.

You can use the all of the parts off the front of the '99 Vert GT for your five lug swap.  From what I have read the rear brakes (axle s, caliper brackets, caliper, pads, and rotors) are all the same from 94-04 (V6 & GT) so if you already have and 8.8 housing from an 86-98 car then all you need is the 94-98 length axles and you are home free.  So basically the axle housing and axles will not work if you want the 94-98 track width.  I am not saying the 99 rear will not work but you will be getting into some funky offsets and backspacing.

I would be curious if anyone knew the axle  to axle  length of the Mark VII rear end.  I know some folks here have used that rear end so if the 09-04 is the same length (would not surprise me one bit) then we have our answer but wheel selection will play its part.

Darren, I do believe the Mark VII rear is 1/2" wider,  to , than the '94-'98 Mustang rear.

Looking at the axle data chart (it shows no  to  measure for Mark 7 btw) it has the '99-04 Mustang axles as having, as nearly as I can tell...1/4" more length than Mark VIII...

Yeah...pays to check that thread that so many toiled over. We need to get one of the Mark VII owners to do some wheel removal and provide that data.

I'm going to the yard(s) tomorrow...if there's a mark VIII, maybe my buddy and I can find a way to get that  to  number. If I can just reemmber to take my tape measure and a couple of somethings or another to lay across the axle s....

Darren, when I completed the backside, I swapped the 93 Cobra MS to a 95 GT MS. I guess air in the lines could be the big problem. I'll purchase that bleeder and give it a try. I could use one anyhow. I was pushing the pedal down and wedging a block of wood between it and the dash, then open a bleeder at a wheel. When the fluid was getting close to stopping, I would close the bleeder and then remove the wood and pump it up. I wonder if there is still air in the MC. Bench bleeding did not go very smoothly.

This would bring up a red flag with me, was it a reman unit ?

I used a new 93 cobra MC and bleeding it wasn't bad at all, it was my first time bench bleeding a MC too.

Yes, it's reman. If I remember correctly, the problem was with the bleeder kit. I can't remember if one of the plastic pieces did not fit, or if it even came with the kit at all. Either way, I made one hellova mess. The pedal is much firmer than what it was with the Cobra unit, but still is just not right. She'll stop on a dime though.

I just rebuilt a mark vii rear end and switched it to cobra brakes.  The housing was exactly the same width as the SN 95, which made the conversion easy.  I sourced a pair of axles from a 94-98 mustang, added cobra brackets, cobra calipers, new cobra rotors, and used sn95 brackets and hoses.  As far as I can tell, every FOX and SN95 generation 8.8 HOUSING is the same, the difference is in the axles and accessory parts.  The mark vii axles were longer than the sn95, but everything else was a direct swap. 

Here's a couple of pics of the rear end, waiting for my chucks brackets and then it will be installed in the bird.  It's basically an SN95 rear now, but it started life as a mark vii rear out of a 1989.

 


Hope this helps -

Geoff

One more thing I might add - the bearings were much wider in the mark vii housing, when I took it apart.  I'll admit, I was a little concerned that it would all go back together properly, but the Ford racing "M-1225-B 8.8 Axle Bearing and Seal Kit" fir perfectly, so it was a non-issue. 

I assume it's just that they used this housing with so many generations of cars that there were production differences year to year with the individual components.  It's good to have a modular foundation and be able to easily build exactly what you want.

Its good to know the housings are the same so with that info the additional width is in the axles which is on the chart ThunderbirdSport302 referred to.  With that info I would say the Mark VII rear end would not be too difficult to find wheels for but the additional width will require more of the wheel to be inboard of the hub.

Darren

There was supposed to be a Mark VII in the yard yesterday, but apparently already went to Sovngarde, as it was nowhere to be found. I was going to pull the rear rotors off and using two halves of a yard stick that I cut for that purpose, measure the s for width, to update the chart..

There will be another. There's a lot of gaps, I'd like to find the missing info and fill it in. I also have the chart saved on my computer...I'm not sure how to post a .pdf, but mine has updated info over the one that's stickied in the "deciphering axles" thread.

Or should I say, deciphering axels.. :D

I will borrow a page from Vinnie, once my chart is complete with ALL info in place...print it off, laminate it, and compile it with other data.

Anyway, back to topic...this stuff is confusing enough without my rambling about random, bare;y-related bits. :]

Lodemia is correct...Fox and Mustang 8.8 housings were the same...EXCEPT for '99-04..those measure at 55.534".
The Fox 8.8 housing is 54.096", as is the TC 8.8, and Mark VIII.

And also, if you come across a '94-'98 Mustang in the Junkyard, and you're looking at doing a 5 lug swap, the axles from identical, be it from the 7.5 or the 8.8....might help you out if you were looking for the 8.8 only and couldn't find any. ;)

I've got 7.5 axles in my TC rear with drum brake setup...went together like it was made for it.

Now, I'll STFU before the thread gets diluted more than it is lol.

This thread has been most helpful. I believe it's helped me successfully plan my 5 lug swap. I have an 88 TC I'm planning to install a set of 2001 Cobra wheels. For the rear, I happen to have a pair of 96 Mustang axles that I can use. If I've read everything correctly,it sounds like after I swap the axles, I can redrill the stock rotors and machine the center for clearance, OR use the 96 rear brake hardware. Does that sound right? If I go the cheap route on the front, does anyone know if the 2001 Cobra wheels will fit the Mark VII rotors?

Not trying to hijack the thread. Should I make this a new thread instead?

Actually, I think I've answered my question concerning the front rotors. Looks like with some slight machining of the centers, or half inch wheels spacers, the wheels will fit.

From what I've read with the newer wheels with small center caps it's not worth it sticking with Fox brakes
Machining, messing with altered offsets, spacers,  dust cover sticking out,  no thanks
Plus the sn95 brakes performance will blow stock fox brakes out of the water do not yourself a huge favor and switch to sn95 brakes with 94-95 Mustang spindles

For the rear you can use some Mpv van rotors but the axle s "might"  needs to be machines to fit and 1/8" spacers might be needed but then you can get off shelf rotors with warranty
I say might because some people needed to do this and some have not,  I got rotors from autozone and I had to machine the s but I ended up not needing the spacers

Here's more info if you go this route
http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/showthread.php?36678-Need-some-advice-one-5-lug-swap-sn95-brakes-setup

Holy , I never heard of using the MPV rotors! I'll have to check it out. Thanks!