General => General Fox T-Bird/Cougar Discussion => Topic started by: treflipboy on June 18, 2011, 11:20:14 PM
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: treflipboy on June 18, 2011, 11:20:14 PM
Don't you hate having to tear apart the engine just to replace one small thing? Dozens of hard to reach screws, tons of hoses, and a few hours of you day? Well that was me... trying to replace VCG's today. (valve cover gaskets) I decided to upgrade the covers seeing as i had 2 new sets laying around as well. and YES i am just a kid. 17 years old and do all my own work. Built this car from ground up. Any questions, feel free to ask.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: treflipboy on June 18, 2011, 11:22:45 PM
..
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: hypostang on June 18, 2011, 11:24:27 PM
Why is the valve cover backwards ?
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 19, 2011, 01:46:32 AM
Good question....why IS that valve cover backwards? Also, that's a tiny little throttlebody. Looks like a stocker. With the mods listed in your signature, an upgraded intake and throttlebody/spacer are in order. Valve cover gaskets aren't too bad. Once you really get into these cars, you'll find that pulling the intake will only take a few minutes, and re-installing it only a few minutes.
Did you get it all back together,and did the throttle cable bracket hit the oil fill on the new valve covers.
Good to see you doing your own work and learning a lot. These are great cars and can really be built to run.
What part of California are you in? I have family in Taft.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 19, 2011, 03:25:08 AM
Maybe I need to throw a cobra intake plaque on my HO upper so I can have a Cobra motor too :O
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: cougarman on June 19, 2011, 07:34:58 AM
Nice Tbird!! Welcome, need more pics.:D
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Bruce M on June 19, 2011, 11:27:53 AM
Those are truck valve covers. The fill goes on the driver side. Oh and vinnie you're right it doesnt take long to remove the upper intake but I dont think that anyone here has had the practice as you. Maybe a little longer than a few mins.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: treflipboy on June 19, 2011, 02:32:17 PM
I originally got these valve covers from a ford racing store, and they had another pair that fit perfectly, but they weren't as nice. Me and a mechanic there sat down and figured out that we can get these valve covers to fit onto my Tbird with just a little bit of modifications done. Everything fits in place and has wiggle room after some cutting of simple things. And the engine came right out of a 1993 cobra, it isn't just a plaque.
and for the Tbody it isn't small. It's a 65 mm. Just put a new gasket/spacer on it today. I live out by Santa Barbara/Santa Maria. I've been into Tbirds for around 3 years. Ripped apart dozens, and currently have a bunch of parts about to go to the dump, so if anyone in the area needs some parts to 86-88 bird let me know. Also gutted a 84 turbocoupe recently, engine and tranny still inside if anyone wants that it's yours free. No front axle, front bumper, or interior. Ripped it apart for a friend. Now it's sitting on corner of my lot until i call those "we buy junk cars" people.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: cougarman on June 19, 2011, 03:08:28 PM
Hate to tell ya but somebody changed your intake, cause that's not a Cobra intake. Probably a stock HO intake, which came with a 65mm TB. Probaly should list those parts you have in the classifieds, people are always looking for parts.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: treflipboy on June 19, 2011, 03:20:22 PM
Correction, just went out and measured. it's a 70mm TB. Gasket says 65/70mm, and i always thought it was 65, but i just went out there.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 19, 2011, 03:47:54 PM
Yes, but that IS an HO intake, not a Cobra...the HO upper won't with a Cobra lower and vice versa.
You sure that's a Cobra engine? Can you look at the heads on the corner and see if they're gt40 versions?
Cobra's had iron gt40's, not the E7 heads, but I'm sure you know this. Just hopin you didn't get burned or something...
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 19, 2011, 05:30:56 PM
Why did they use the stock intake on a Cobra engine, and that is NOT a 65mm t-body. Someone told you wrong. No worries, it's an easy upgrade. The Cobra intake is a totally different setup. Staggered runner holes,and no intake plate, just a badge that sticks to the upper itself. The t-body on your car has the step down in size that severely narrows the air intake opening....I'd bet it's a 50mm stocker.....where as the 65 is a level, straight through design. The Cobras also used 24# injectors with a unique computer that was only for the Cobra. I had to get an aftermarket Mass Air meter to run my 24# injectors. Cheaper than the Cobra computer by a LOT. LOL. I'm using an A9P computer right now to run the Sport's engine.
What radiator do you have? I just bought an aftermarket piece which should be here tomorrow. Looks a lot like the one you have from what I can tell.
Toss up a few more pictures of the re-assembled engine bay and the interior. The car is a good looking Bird. What are the next plans for it?
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 19, 2011, 05:33:42 PM
Quote from: treflipboy;361768
Correction, just went out and measured. it's a 70mm TB. Gasket says 65/70mm, and i always thought it was 65, but i just went out there.
What part of the throttlebody are you measuring? That's a 50mm. I have a 70mm on my Sport and compared to yours, and even my 65mm that I just sold, it's a lot bigger.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: thunderjet302 on June 20, 2011, 04:30:26 PM
If you have the 93 Cobra GT40 heads the stock T-bird intake you have on the car is really holding the engine back. The intake and 65mm throttle body from a 5.0 Explorer would make a great upgrade so you can use the power of the Gt40 heads and the cam you have.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: mtgmike on June 21, 2011, 11:57:26 AM
Yeah, dont take the comments personally, people are just trying to help. It sounds like you are measuring the outside lip of the throttle body. The true measurement is basically the diameter of the throttle blade. You can see the big step down in one pic.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 22, 2011, 12:57:11 PM
Actually the job is not that difficult. The upper comes off in 10 minutes wearing BOXING GLOVES
1 Tools 2 Gaskets 3 new VALVE COVERS 4 PIZZA 5 BEERS and or soda 6 Neat new Valve covers 7 Finished!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
WAIT A MINUTE!!!!! Hold up on that car young GENTLEMEN. You are 17 NO beers for you. Just soda
Nice job and i like the new covers . Peace Tom
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: hypostang on June 22, 2011, 01:06:43 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;361975
Actually the job is not that difficult. The upper comes off in 10 minutes wearing BOXING GLOVES Peace Tom
Now that is some funny stuff .... because its so true :bowdown:
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 22, 2011, 04:33:25 PM
I'd bet money I could take my upper off with a blind fold. I just need someone to hand me the tools.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 22, 2011, 08:55:57 PM
Yes that job looks real complicated but its a piece of CAKE!!!
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 22, 2011, 09:36:31 PM
Mmmmmm, I like cake.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: DeltaElite121 on June 24, 2011, 12:39:00 AM
Yeah I've decided if my car stays around long enough for this, that when I get around to replacing those (which I have the Felpro's in the box waiting) I'm just yanking all of that out and going to a carbureted setup instead.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 24, 2011, 06:31:21 PM
A CARB?????? What is that????? Do they still make them????
Actually the EFI system is light years better than a CARB. For what it takes to remove that upper its a no brainier. Personally i would stay with the EFI setup its much BETTER all around
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Miah on June 24, 2011, 09:55:46 PM
CARB are great !! Every one has their own opinion on the issue. I like them both. This thread has some people going back and forth on the issue. If I ever have the cash to do a V8 swap I will go with a carb. http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/5-0-mustangs/52616-efi-vs-carb.html . Granted I live in Texas where it is very flat.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: RunninWild on June 25, 2011, 05:34:28 PM
Quote from: thunderbirdsport302;361724
maybe i need to throw a cobra intake plaque on my ho upper so i can have a cobra motor too :o
hahahah
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 25, 2011, 06:25:32 PM
Quote from: Miah;362168
CARB are great !! Every one has their own opinion on the issue. I like them both. This thread has some people going back and forth on the issue. If I ever have the cash to do a V8 swap I will go with a carb. http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forums/5-0-mustangs/52616-efi-vs-carb.html . Granted I live in Texas where it is very flat.
Not to get to NUTS about this but if i ever had the money i would do the following. Just a comparison. Not trying to be a wise GUY..
Here goes
If i ever had the money
1 I would convert to drum brakes 2 I would convert to a GENERATOR 3 I would convert back to POINTS 4 I would convert back to manual brakes 5 I would convert back to manual steering 6 I would convert back to a 3 SPEEDER 7 I would convert back to regular tires 8 I would convert back to tube tires 9 I would remove the hydraulic lifters 10 I would remove those 4 valves per cylinder.
Normally when people do not understand new technology they remove it. EFI systems are cleaner produce more HP and have better drivability than a carb. Vehicles would never be able to pass an emission test with a carb. On a straight 1320 car their may not be a difference. But on a street car its a no comparison issue. Be it as it may that is basically the issue. Some are more comfortable with carbs but they are antiquated. Their is no vehicle on this planet that runs a carb from the factory that i know of. Now direct injection will replace the traditional EFI systems of today. Technology is moving on and its getting CRAZY. Just me could be wrong. Thanks
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 06:42:32 PM
Forget all that ....I'm installing bicycle pedals and a long chain to the differential.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 25, 2011, 07:11:21 PM
Firstly, what is the relevance of your post?
Quote from: TOM Renzo;362217
Not to get to NUTS about this but if i ever had the money i would do the following. Just a comparison. Not trying to be a wise GUY..
Here goes
If i ever had the money Just go buy a '56 Chevy, or Ford...they'd have all the things listed below, except possibly "regular tires"....I assume this is you trying (and failing horribly) to make a dig at folks running drag radials, slicks, and the like? What a tool you are. Surprised you even know how to use a computer. :rollin:
1 I would convert to drum brakes why? brake fade is super awesome, right? 2 I would convert to a GENERATOR Yes, because alternators are not a good idea? 3 I would convert back to POINTS I've dealt with more points ignitions in my life than necessary, if you want to go back to dinosaur times, well, have at it homeslice. 4 I would convert back to manual brakes Yes, because you are undoubtedly superhuman, and don't need the effort provided by engine vacuum to stop a car that is woefully inadequate with stocks brakes as it is. 5 I would convert back to manual steering Manual steering is stupid for a street driven, or daily driven car. There, I said it. Get over it. 6 I would convert back to a 3 SPEEDER What the shag is a 3 SPEEDER? 7 I would convert back to regular tires As opposed to irregular tires? 8 I would convert back to tube tires Be my guest. 9 I would remove the hydraulic lifters Go ahead...I'll laugh while you are adjusting your valve lash every other day. 10 I would remove those 4 valves per cylinder. Yep, because 2 valve engines are more powerful.
Normally when people do not understand new technology they remove it. EFI systems are cleaner produce more HP and have better drivability than a carb. Vehicles would never be able to pass an emission test with a carb. On a straight 1320 car their may not be a difference. But on a street car its a no comparison issue. Be it as it may that is basically the issue. Some are more comfortable with carbs but they are antiquated. Their is no vehicle on this planet that runs a carb from the factory that i know of. Now direct injection will replace the traditional EFI systems of today. Technology is moving on and its getting CRAZY. Just me could be wrong. Thanks
Normally, when people make an ass of themselves on a small forum (this one would be a GREAT example) they generally should just shut the hell up, and not continue posting. Especially with about 7 different user accounts, like you've been doing. I don't give 2 flying balls of shiznit how many cars you've built. Utterly don't care. You've proved your ignorance in the thread that got locked, and if you've built as many cars, especially Ford stuff, then you'd know to just replace an ignition switch and not bother with a dealership. You are a narcissistic drama queen assmonkey and only the second person in my seven years of posting here that I have ever put on ignore. Considering the levels of stupid we've dealt with here before, that's saying quite a lot.
And what I think about carburetors? People who are too stupid and lazy to pull codes, but would rather tear off several hundred dollars' worth of efi parts for a piece of shiznit gas-wasting carb and a chinese 4 barrel intake.
My first 2 vehicles were carb and points, and I was always working on it and rebuilding, and replacing the stuff. You want it, you can have it all. Far far easier to pull codes, and only a true dinosaur mechanic will say the carbs, and points systems are easier to diagnose than an efi system.
Lastly, I'm totally into classic cars, as well as newer ones, but do NOT tell me that you're gonna make more power with a carb on the same engine than you would with fuel injection. Carbs have their place...lawnmowers and classic cars being the only thing to come to mind, and, well, those knuckle-draggers in nascar who turn left and smash the gas for a whole race. Did I strike a nerve? :shakeass:
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 07:40:02 PM
Tom was making a point about the difference between old and new. I don't think he actually meant he wants all that old stuff.....just being smart-ellic. LOL. He was making the point that carbs are outdated, and that they don't make cars with them anymore. And if you're going carb, why not get the generator, tube tires, 3 speed, etc. I don't think any ill feelings were intended.
In my own opinion, carb...EFI...it's up to the owner. I like EFI. I wouldn't own a carbed car (I would, but I'd convert to EFI), but if the owner likes a carb, then I think he/she should install one. Who really cares? The owner should be able to do what they like and what makes them more comfortable, and have our support as a group and respect for their own personal taste and "wants" for their car....my own opinion.
I've seen a lot of people here, do a lot of things to their cars that I would never do. Are they wrong...no. It's just a difference in taste and opinions.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 07:45:29 PM
Lets get back on topic and move ahead. The original thread starter doesn't need all this in his thread. It doesn't need to get crazy over the difference in a couple of opinions.
Like the old saying goes....take what you like, leave the rest.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 25, 2011, 09:05:44 PM
Yeah, you are correct Vinnie...if Tom should decide to smear dog turds all over his car(s), the proper thing to do would not consist of calling him a name, or pointing and laughing, but saying 'attaboy" and pat 'im on the back, right? :evilgrin::rollin:
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 09:25:06 PM
There's a right way, and a wrong way of making an opinion known. Do we rise up, or do you sink down? I'm not judging. Anyone can say what they want, but I was taught by my dad....."say what you mean....mean what you say, but don't say anything mean". He said it was an issue with character. Which was funny to me because he was a career Marine and twice Viet Nam vet. He is smart though.
I still love you Beau......but not in a prison kind of way. By the way, are you having a bad day?
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 25, 2011, 09:33:29 PM
Nahh, I'm just funnin' with him in a probably too-harsh way...
Havin' a great day actually, soon as I get the kiddos tucked away in bed, it's off to put on a steering rack :)
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: hypostang on June 25, 2011, 09:36:41 PM
Quote from: vinnietbird;362242
There's a right way, and a wrong way of making an opinion known. Do we rise up, or do you sink down? I'm not judging. Anyone can say what they want, but I was taught by my dad....."say what you mean....mean what you say, but don't say anything mean". He said it was an issue with character. Which was funny to me because he was a career Marine and twice Viet Nam vet. He is smart though.
Good post Vinnie I feel the other stuff was handled in the other thread . and I understood the tongue in cheek in this one.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 09:38:27 PM
Quote from: ThunderbirdSport302;362243
Nahh, I'm just funnin' with him in a probably too-harsh way...
Havin' a great day actually, soon as I get the kiddos tucked away in bed, it's off to put on a steering rack :)
Good to hear....the funnin' and the steering rack.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 25, 2011, 10:08:57 PM
Quote from: ThunderbirdSport302;362222
Firstly, what is the relevance of your post?
Normally, when people make an ass of themselves on a small forum (this one would be a GREAT example) they generally should just shut the hell up, and not continue posting. Especially with about 7 different user accounts, like you've been doing. I don't give 2 flying balls of shiznit how many cars you've built. Utterly don't care. You've proved your ignorance in the thread that got locked, and if you've built as many cars, especially Ford stuff, then you'd know to just replace an ignition switch and not bother with a dealership. You are a narcissistic drama queen assmonkey and only the second person in my seven years of posting here that I have ever put on ignore. Considering the levels of stupid we've dealt with here before, that's saying quite a lot.
And what I think about carburetors? People who are too stupid and lazy to pull codes, but would rather tear off several hundred dollars' worth of efi parts for a piece of shiznit gas-wasting carb and a chinese 4 barrel intake.
My first 2 vehicles were carb and points, and I was always working on it and rebuilding, and replacing the stuff. You want it, you can have it all. Far far easier to pull codes, and only a true dinosaur mechanic will say the carbs, and points systems are easier to diagnose than an efi system.
Lastly, I'm totally into classic cars, as well as newer ones, but do NOT tell me that you're gonna make more power with a carb on the same engine than you would with fuel injection. Carbs have their place...lawnmowers and classic cars being the only thing to come to mind, and, well, those knuckle-draggers in nascar who turn left and smash the gas for a whole race. Did I strike a nerve? :shakeass:
Wow i was just pointing out that technology moves on. Either you CUT BAIT OR FISH. I have no desire of impressing anyone. Basically my life would not change one bit if i move on. But i like to pass on info. My real name is RENZO. And i do not make it known where my shop is. Been in the business to long and do not want people i do not know to know where it is. As far as the post i was just showing the advances in automotive technology. I run all kinds of modern systems in my builds including EFI. I have not built a carbed engine in AGES other than the supercharged BIG block chevys that come out of the shop. As far as the user names i used my kids signatures. Reason being is i did not know how to set up my own. So my kids told me to use theirs. I admit i am computer ignorant. The post was a spoof of old technoligy showing how old things die out. Years ago mechanics did not know how to work on the new stuff. Switching back to carbs is foolish with the EFI systems of today. I know i said i would not post any of our cars but i would like you to see the JUNK we build. I cant believe what you posted about me other than that this is one of the antiquates cars we built and won several best in shows. Do you really think i would want that old JUNK. I was just making a point of the old stuff that died out with technology. Seems that your Hatred for me extends beyond my post. Care to explain. I would really like to know why. Do you think i dropped off a turnip truck. Been in this business for decades. And dont call me NAMES. Thank you.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 25, 2011, 10:25:15 PM
Tom was making a point about the difference between old and new. I don't think he actually meant he wants all that old stuff.....just being smart-ellic. LOL. He was making the point that carbs are outdated, and that they don't make cars with them anymore. And if you're going carb, why not get the generator, tube tires, 3 speed, etc. I don't think any ill feelings were intended.
Thanks Vinnie that is exactly what i meant. Years ago older mechanics left the business like my DAD when all the modern stuff came out. He would not work on modern stuff. He specialized in the old school stuff. Not because he was an old timer. He just did not want to retrain. I on the other hand had to work on modern stuff as i do. Everything changes and if we want to stay in the business we move on to modern technology. My post just showed the advances we made in the automotive industry. My dad used to remove HEI systems and install Point dizzys. He just did not know the new stuff. Actually one time i saw him setting the valves in his big block chivelle with a feeler gauge. He set the rockers at .012Intake and .018 exhaust. Only problem the engine had a hydraulic LIFTERS. But because the valves were quiet he said they were to tight. Well thanks and sorry for the confusion. You knew what i was saying.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 25, 2011, 10:40:39 PM
Yep, because 2 valve engines are more powerful. Actually this is the only statement you posted that is true. Guess you got Lucky on this answer.
well looks like its time to move on because TEMPERS ARE RUNNING RATHER HIGH. Hay how do you like the CHEVY????????????????? Neat RIGHT. Separates the men from the!!! Well you know
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 25, 2011, 10:45:36 PM
That's cool, even to a decidedly -non GM person...
Did you see the youtube stuff on the 1400-something horsepower blown 572-propelled 'Bird? The engine had problems, and still laid down over 1400 ponies..
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 25, 2011, 10:54:18 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;362257
Yep, because 2 valve engines are more powerful. Actually this is the only statement you posted that is true. Guess you got Lucky on this answer.
well looks like its time to move on because TEMPERS ARE RUNNING RATHER HIGH. Hay how do you like the CHEVY????????????????? Neat RIGHT. Separates the men from the!!! Well you know
Hmmm, so the 4 cam 4.6 (Cobra, Navigator) and the 3 valve 4.6 make less power than the 2 valve version? No wonder Ford put em in their vehicles...can't sell too much power!
Oh, Ferrari and Lamborghini must also be down on power, they use (mostly) 4 valves per cylinder...
No, sorry, an engine will make more power if it has 4 valves per cylinder, than it would with just 2. It's been proven.
Temper? no, not here, but I do have an over developed sense of humor.
Chevies? I got 2 of 'em...never have been impressed with the 3 or 4 I've had the displeasure of driving before, neither. Sadly, that's all that's roadworthy here right now...
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 25, 2011, 11:06:54 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;362257
Yep, because 2 valve engines are more powerful. Actually this is the only statement you posted that is true. Guess you got Lucky on this answer.
well looks like its time to move on because TEMPERS ARE RUNNING RATHER HIGH. Hay how do you like the CHEVY????????????????? Neat RIGHT. Separates the men from the!!! Well you know
Time to move on? From the forum? Not cool to do. You just stick it out and all will be golden. It's all just talk.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: TOM Renzo on June 26, 2011, 06:48:36 AM
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 26, 2011, 01:24:39 PM
So what you're saying here, is that a car (mind you, a very track oriented car) with 2 valve heads is faster than another car (also very track oriented) with an engine half the size, and not as good weight distribution?
Remember back when the ZR-1 'Vette was released, back in what was it, '89 or something?
It had the 32 valve all aluminum 5.7....remember that. How much more power it made than the standard 5.7?
And yes, the new Vette has set a 'Ring lap record...not that THAT has jack shiznit to do with 2 valve heads...I'd say the near 50-50 weight distribution is a bigger asset in this case....the ring isn't a dyno, it's a road course.
The guys that have swapped the volvo head onto their 2.3 engines..I don't think they did it because they knew they'd be making less power with it....
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Beau on June 26, 2011, 01:33:13 PM
And anyway, let's start a different thread about this if you feel the need to convince me on your argument...I'm sure the OP isn't thrilled about us shiznitting up his thread, and for that, i apologize.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: vinnietbird on June 26, 2011, 04:52:53 PM
Alright,alright......your both pretty, let it go.
Title: Don't you hate having to do all this?...
Post by: Bruce M on June 26, 2011, 06:07:19 PM