So today I had an appointment to get my T-bird alignment done after doing the new steering rack, pump, etc. Of course the one day I make an appointment somewhere, it rains!
It has probably been 6-7 years since I really drove the car in any heavy rain and let me tell you I forgot about some of the shortcomings of the old girl.
1.) The windshield wipers suck! I never noticed this before but now that I drive newer vehicles on a daily basis it really makes the 23 yr old wipers on the 'bird seem archaic and inefficient.
2.) Headlights are about 1 candlepower...this was the ONLY thing about the car I did not like when I drove it daily. The headlights were always super dim and eventually were "foggy" on the inside. Back in the day before I put the new headlights on, I drove around with the brights on all the time at night just so I could see!
3.) 17x9 wheels + py roads around here = darty steering feel.
However, I still LOVE driving this old :bowdown: T-bird. It just feels right sitting in the drivers seat. I feel way more comfortable in this than my S197 Mustang (probably because I've put about 53,000 more miles on the T-bird over the course of time). You can see out of it great, you sit more upright, and it just "gets around" well. I do think the new quicker-ratio rack made a big difference in the steering feel of the car.
So I am one step closer to being prepared for Power Tour. Next on the list: fix drivers side door lock (it quit working), re-tint the windows, and fix some play in the steering column. I had to drop the column once and lost a bolt...ever since then it has had some side-to-side play.
Well sorry to ramble on guys, I'm just excited spring is here and that I am driving my 'bird again.
I can't wait to get my XR-7 out of storage! It has the quick ratio steering, and it does make a difference. My 83 that I daily drive in the winter has the old sloppy rack, and while it is easier to drive, it's not real "fun". Both the 83 and the 85 have sucky headlights. I ran Sylvania SilverStars in my old Marquis, and they helped. I should try them again.
Try polishing your headlights with brake fluid. It eats plastic and paint, so be careful. From the way I understand it, that is all the headlight restore kits are, "watered down" brake fluid.
I know exactly what you mean about the car just feeling right. Right now my car needs suspension work, motor mounts, and a 5 speed. I got a saftey guy I can use to get around that, but I really want to fix it right while I can park it. It's real tempting to just throw a temp tag on it a drive around for a couple weeks though.
Don't worry, you're not rambling. I think everyone here can relate to you. I've been able to start driving my Thunderbird regularly as well, I love it. Just driving down the road, enjoying the comfy seats, hearing the rumble of 8, 27 year old cylinders firing away with as much power as they can muster.
I personally like the light steering; these are luxury cars after all, not Mustangs. Other cars feel...well...not like my Thunderbird!
I have new lights and wipers, and no complaints on the Sport. The wipers are great, and while the head lights aren't as great as my wife's new Maxima, they are pretty good. The Sport handles well, even with the 17x9 and 10's on it. I know what you mean about the steering on bumpy roads, but that's the wheels, not the car. It wasn't made for them from the factory.I would only change one more thing about the Sport. I want it to be quieter on the inside. Even after the sound deadener, it is better, but not yet where I want it. I'll be doing a little more to work on that eventually.
I've yet to drive mine this year. It's almost time. The roads are clear of salt. I just need to get a rain free day to pull it out of the garage and change the oil. I can't drive in the rain or I'll have to clean the undercarriage again....
I've thought of trying those Silverstars. Sound like you think they are worth it?
I actually bought some stuff made to brighten up headlights, tail lights etc. Can't remember for the life of me who made it (I want to say Mothers) but it made my headlights look like new again. I put new headlights on the car in 03 or 04.
I can agree with that. I think it would be nice to have my car as it is now but also have a 100% stock fox T-bird/Cougar right down to the 14" wheels. I sometimes miss how my car looked and drove stock with the 14" 8-holes and white letter tires.
Well Vin I never remember thinking the wipers were bad until now. I even put new blades on last summer. Maybe the wipers on my Silverado are just that good, but driving the car in the dark and pouring down rain made me less than relaxed, lol.
My headlights have always been horrible. Even with the new lights they pale in comparison to modern vehicular lighting...but that's part of the fun of driving an older vehicle.
I know the steering is the wheels...its probably worth putting up with for the change in handling.
x2 on the rain. Its done a lot of that lately! At least they are saying it will be nice today/later this week. I plan on cleaning her up after work tonight.
I buy the best wipers I can get. They're worth it.
The pros and cons of the Fox chassis. They feel light but the truth be told the suspension was never raved about back when they were new. Even new they felt kind of....indirect so to speak. The Tbirds and Cougars as "personal" coupes were closer to luxury than sport. Improvements for handling usually translate to harsh but handling is improved. Everything is a compromise.
In my experience the Foxes as compared to the MN-12 feel much better but the MN-12 handles way better even though it's 600 lbs heavier. Especially in the rain. To me the disadvantage to the MN-12s is the weight and size (six inches wider) but they are quieter and really closer to the MKIII in feel than the Fox Tbird/Cougar is to the MKVII. It's even more noticable with the 3.8. The lighter front end actually enhances the feel IMO. I've driven the 3.8s almost exclusively. I didn't like the feel of the 5.0 as much but at least it has power.
In every case however the larger size of the Tbird/Cougar is way better than the Mustang and the back seat is usable too!
I can see all of those points. The wiper motors do degenerate over time; the motors can be rebuilt but I've had decent luck finding NOS ones. They help tremendously, along with a top-level charging system in the car. I believe the headlights are still available new from Ford but IIRC the prices are starting to creep upwards (http://www.turbotbird.com has the p/n's and pricing in their FAQ section).
Heh...lemme tell you about driving the convertible in the rain.
Cowl shake + 17" tires + modified suspension + leaking top = FUN FUN FUN!
It's like stepping on eggshells the whole time. But understeer is, surprising, just about what you expect from a coupe.
The suspension is actually a hair softer in the back now, thanks to the CHE arms. It's surprisingly civil.
So the key is to just slow down, try to stay in the groove of the road, don't make any sudden moves, and allow extra braking time. I've never had a problem in the few times that I had to drive it in rainy weather. I mean, if I wipe out my car, it's not replaceable...that is also a motivating factor. ;)
Eric if I had your car I would just make sure it stayed in the dry! Hell my car would be hard to replace...yours would be nearly impossible.
I tried but when you're hundreds of miles from home, going to or from a car show, you don't have much choice but to keep driving through the rain. It's been rained ON plenty of times in hotel parking lots and at the car shows themselves. That's okay because the engine compartment and undercarriage don't get dirty (due to the car cover). Ah well...every once in a great while, letting Mother Nature wash the underside is fine. ;)
The scariest moment in driving that I ever had with the convertible was, believe it or not, in totally dry weather. Going to VA, I arrived on I-64 at dusk, sun to my back, in a walled construction zone (left and right sides), no construction going on so no speed restrictions, and three lanes of packed traffic going 80 mph. And I was trapped in the left lane against the wall, with nowhere to go, no idea of the road ahead, in a foreign town. Couldn't slow down, couldn't speed up, couldn't get over for probably 5-10 miles. I was actually starting to get a touch of vertigo. Threw my britches away when I finally got to the hotel LOL.
I think the most fun I've ever had was going back home to OH from Fords@Carlisle. Normally it's a 4.5 hour drive. For some reason, that afternoon the car was running really well and it asked me to just go. And go I did. Probably averaged 85-90 on the PA turnpike. There were no cops out, and it was a great early evening ride until I got to the Pittsburgh area and all the douches came out of the woodwork. Saw a few 100+ mph runs there to get around them. Made it home in just under 3 hours, for 250+ miles.
Like I said, I'm not afraid to drive it. But water throws a big monkey wrench into any driving situation and you have to be extry cautious.
I got caught in the rain with the T-bird once last summer. Let me tell you a AOD with a 2800 stall converter and valve body mods is a bit scarry in the rain. The car can burn the tires easily on dry pavement and spin them again on the 1-2 shift. I had to start from a stop in 2nd gear (thankfully I've got an epoxy mod valve body so I can do that) to get going as the tires slipped something fierce in the rain.
First time I had the Cougar out in weather was 2 weeks after I bought it. The first time I had had any RWD on questionable roads. If i hadn't spent most of my previous winter driving hours drifting in a FWD family car, I probably would have lost her over the median. Surprised the heck, and scared the outta me, after sitting for 5 years, I didn't really think she could do it. Now that Ive done it a few times, I really want to find out what it'll be like with a new gear set in the back.
I know what you mean. I looooove driving my cougar. It needs some struts cause the thing's a boat right now, but honestly thats kinda fun lol.
I took it out on the road today and burned the tires up a little and just let her fly. It feels good. It sucks that I can't drive it right now cause I still need a tag but I'll be so happey when it gets going again.
But the weird thing to me is that after driving my 96 for months, it feels foreign getting into the 88. The 96's interior design is perfect. I think from a driver oriented point of view, it couldn't be better. Getting into the 88 the shifter is farther away, the steering wheel feels different, the ignition is in a different spot, the lights and turn signal locations are different, but its not bad, just different. But, the 88 is SOOOOOO much more fun to drive to me. It corners better, steers easier, feels lighter, and just feels.... better. It almost can't be explained.
I do agree that the 88 Cougar is about the best styled ones out there. In general Ford got it right in 87/88.
I find my '88 way more comfortable than my bro's '96 T-bird. Maybe its just that my seats have a spot worn into them in the shape of my butt! I never did like the way the MN-12's drove compared to the Fox's. They are nice looking cars but I just love the fox's more.
Well I had mine out for the first time this year :D. I changed the oil today and drove it around for about a hour. I never realized how old it felt when I was driving the MN-12 because they were so close in how they drove and rode. Now that I'm driving a modern car (Focus) I can feel the difference.
Cons:
The steering, even with the quick ratio rack, sucks. There is minimal road feel. It feels like I could twirl the wheel with my pinky finger.
The stock brakes suck. They stop the car ok but not like they should stop a 3700 lb car.
Stiff tires + stiff suspension = bumpy ride on pot holed winter roads.
Push rod engines do not rev as fast a DOHC engines.
Pros:
This car can haul. It has a silly amount of torque and slides around like it's on ice when you mat the throttle:burnout:.
The car rides beautifully on the highway at speed.
The thing pulls like a freight train when you want to pass someone at 60mph. Just mat it and before you know it you're doing 90 :hick:.
The interior on the T-bird is so much nicer than the Focus.
I still love this car. It's fun to drive and gets looks, because no one owns one anymore ;). I wish I could drive it every day.....
That's funny, that's always the FIRST thing I notice when I start mine up. The only difference is that I love it. The MN12 has terrible power steering assist. The 88 is real POWER steering:D
My crown vic I drive with my palm over the horn. That is REAL assistance right there.
-Hell, and I thought that "edgy/twitchy" feeling was an alignment issue! I never even considered that it was the rims.
--Eric, what do you mean by cowl shake? I'm guessing this is a convertible-only issue?
---I personally love the steering on my bird, and with the new wheels, it is EXTREMELY responsive!
----I do need to put new blades on the wipers, but they aren't too terrible...Until it starts coming down sideways at 70Mph!
-----The Sylvania Silverstars are definitely the way to go, but make sure your charging system is TOP NOTCH! I put them in my '90 Mazda pickup, and they work GREAT, but it really pulls the battery down when they're on. Add to that a blower fan and a turn signal and the alt definitely starts complaining.
Oh yeah, I noticed immediately when I put on my Cobra's that they grab every groove in the road and really pull the car around.
Yes, it's from having the roof chopped off. All convertibles have a degree of cowl shake, it's just a matter of how much. Newer cars usually have a lot more bracing or supports to counteract it. The A-pillars were beefed up in my car but otherwise, that's all the conversion company did to try to help.
HELL YES. One of the reasons I can't wait to get a new motor in the blue beast. One time at a cruise-in this guy let me sit in his 1971 Lincoln Continental MkIII, the seat was like a waterbed, the A/C was blowing absolute zero on me, and with that 5000+ lb behemoth standing STILL, I was moving the steering wheel with my pinky almost effortlessly. Impressed? There's an understatement right there...
I have no idea why you guys like the overly boosted grandma steering.
I guess if I wanted to drive a race car I'd want something like my mom's '07 civic LOL. That thing has zero slop anywhere, it's very stiff and tight. If I had that in say the silver cat, it would be far easier to compensate quicker when I get the ass end way out there. BUT....that's not normal driving. And if I feel the need to do that, I better be somewhere that I've no risk of smashing the thing or someone else's. It's easier and takes less effort to keep it straight on the highway if you have crosswinds or it's just wandering because of the road, and less effort obviously to turn at any time. Hey....these are luxury cars. They're designed to spoil you like that. ;) And I'm sure spoiled!
When people start using words like "road feel" I fall asleep. :rollin: Yes, that more hard-edged intimate experience in say my dad's '79 spitfire, puts things in perspective, and makes one of these cars feel like an entirely over-bloated pointless behemoth.....until you think about all of those situations where the little slingshot would get aggravating. To some people, it's not I guess, hence why they drive a slammed S2000 with thousands spent on suspension work, brutal power, and a harsh overall ride, as a daily vehicle. I just couldn't put up with it. :D
I just want a little stiffer steering with some road feel, like the Focus;).
Anything you want...YOU GOT IT.....anyyyything at alllllll...YOU GOT IT....BAAAAAAAAAAABYYYYYYYYYYY
I agree. My brother-in-law's got an Integra which is lowered to about 3" from the ground and its a 5 speed. Its his daily. There is no way I could stand to drive it everyday. Its too harsh, you have to be wary of every pothole and runoff gulley and every driveway/parking lot that crosses a sidewalk. Not to mention having to use the 5 speed in Orlando traffic every day would just get ridiculous.
I like my boat of a Cougar, and I love the way it sticks to the ground even without having to be close to it:p
I just drove my JD lawnmower (with power steering) and it has more steering assist than my T-bird now. lol...I like it.
Geesh if you guys want really easy steering drive a 75 Thunderbird. Pinky finger steering at it's finest ;).
The easiest car to steer that I have owned was a 65 Plymouth fury. Huuuge car, one finger steering. The tightest steering I have driven was my 94 geo metro with manual rack. Talk about swerving potholes! You'd lose that car in a pothole. I hit a groundhog once and it felt like I ran over a 3ft boulder- POW!
hehe! That describes my old Daily Driver to a tee! :D (Attached)
'94 Integra, lots of suspension work and drove like it was on rails - nothing I own will likely ever handle as good as that thing did. The WS6 handled great too. Either way, I still love my Thunderbird and as someone else said nothing else has ever felt as good as it to me.
I don't know why you guys all complain that your cars wander and do all this stuff. My car even before I did the suspension never did any of that, It always felt like it was on rails. Of course my car wanders now, but I know what thats from, the inch of toe out and 3.5* of camber in the front end. I doubt any car as near to stock suspension wise could be much better. I have a supercoupe also, but I truly hate that car. Rides like a boat and doesnt handle nearly as good as my TC. I always end up turning the steering too fast at an autox so I sit wayy back in the seat. Steering is real responsive too, as in if you move the wheel at all you're changing lanes!
Mine doesn't wander at all. It goes right where I point it. I just wish it had more road feel through the steering wheel. It's seems really over-boosted.
Funny, I have plenty of road feel in the Mark, maybe I have a worn out rack, or maybe the extra weight makes that much difference, but when I drive my buddy's '86, it has that over-boosted feel, like I could spin the steering wheel Price is Right style with almost no effort.
The Mark's may have gotten the quick ratio rack, like the Stangs and Bird sports/TC's.