Guys, My breaks were kind of mushy and I just figured it was a leaky rear brake drum cylinder. I replaced both cylinders since they were cheap. I also replaced the rear shoes, drums, and master cylinder(also cheap). I blead the brakes and they still feel the same! The car will stop, however the peddle it is almost all the way to the floor. I can hear that wooshing sound from the brake booster too.
What should I check?
Was the wooshing sound always there? Did you prime the master cylinder be4 you installed it?
+1
It sounds like you've got an unsealed or low system. Check for leaks. Are you doing this alone? Do you have a power bleeder?
OK I checked for leaks and there is no leaks in the system. I re-bled the brakes and I have peddle, ONLY when the car is off. Once I start the car, my peddle sinks all the way to the floor.
Whats the problem! I dont think the grommet on the booster check valve bleeding because the car does not change rpm at idle when I press on the peddle. Is the brake booster bad?
Ford DIY Service Manual:
"Pedal goes to floor" - low fluid or leak
Ford Shop Manual:
"Excessive pedal travel or pedal goes to floor" - air in system, loose brake tube end fittings, drum brakes improperly adjusted, loose wheel bearings (front), loose/missing pedal bushings/fasteners
Vacuum *shouldn't* be an issue WRT to pedal travel. That said, it's possible to have a vacuum leak that doesn't make itself evident at idle. In above post, I bolded what looked to be something you hadn't double-checked.
I didnt adjust the rear drum shoes. I was told they were self adjusting, so I just installed them and thats it. Let me know if I have to adjust them.
They self-adjust from being used, so you have to drive for them to do their thing.
Do the brakes stop the car at all?
yes, but the peddle is against the floor almost
87 manual says the drum brakes self adjust by braking lightly going in reverse, then pulling forward a bit, then backing up and braking again, until the brakes get tight enough. You have to adjust them out to where they are just touching when you install them or you won't get pedal.
There should be an inspection plug you can pop out to access the adjuster without taking off the wheels.
Your car should be similar.
Yup, adjust the rear drums out. There's an access port at the bottom of the backing plates. You have to use a bladed screwdriver to turn the adjuster. Usually the adjuster portion is facing the rear of the car, so on the driver side you need to rotate the adjuster up, and on the pass side down, to get get the adjuster to expand.
If you can't figure out which way, just pull the wheel/drum and adjust it until you can just barely get the drum back on, and you should be good.
Yeah, all that, and the unanswered question from above: Did you bench bleed the MC before installation?
I bench bled the MC before I installed it. I adjusted the the brakes and no change. I just got done removing the brake booster because there was nothing else left to check. Before I removed it, while the car was off, I pushed on the peddle and peddle was hard. I then went under the hood and removed the booster check valve and depressed the peddle again, and it was just as hard with the brake booster open. I did this same test with 5 cars in the jy and the result was different. With the jy cars the peddle would go to the floor and you would hear that woosh of air from the hole where the check valve was removed. On my car you cant hear the woosh of air and the peddle goes nowhere and is hard. Pulled it out and took it to parts store and its definitely the problem.
Anyone know an easy way to install a brake booster. Sure was a b*tch to remove it. what really complicated things were the clutch cable and the fuel lines.
Not meaning to hi-jack this thread, but I've been fighting this same problem for a while now. My brakes work, but the pedal feels terrible. I would bleed them, the brakes feel solid while the car is off; but as soon as I turn the car on, the pedal goes almost to the floor. I've replaced the master cylinder, brake booster, all three rubber hoses, 90% of the metal lines, both front calipers, both rear shoes and springs. Old drums though. We just grinded them down...
Does this sound like my problem would be the drums are out of adjustment? My father thinks that the problem might be this kinda...block below the master cylinder. All the lines from the MC screw into the "block" and then back out to the actual brakes. He's thinking this because it's just about the only thing I didn't replace yet.
Well I replaced the brake booster by just taking the motor mounts loose and raising the engine up enough to get booster in. Went in without much effort. Only thing I didnt do was put all 4 nuts back on . The upper left nut was to hard to get to so that one didnt go back in. I'm sure I'm not the only person to ever do that.
Anyway after installing, THE ISSUE IS STILL THERE!!!! ARRRGH! Just like you, I replaced everything but that rectangular copper colored thingy in between the brake lines and MC.
I just gave up and brought the car to a brake specialist. I will be sure to share the outcome with you, so you can fix your car as well.
Thanks, please do. I would do the same if I had the money.
Well, I just found the problem and you guys and the mechanic were right. Rear drums have two different size shoes. The smaller ones go to the front, and the bigger ones go to the back part of the drum. In my haste to install, I put both the small ones on one side and both big ones on the other. DUH!!! Thats why the brakes were uneven as you guys stated, and I didnt have peddle. On one side the shoes werent even touching the drum (both small shoes) and on the other side the shoes werent even on the brake cylinders.(both big shoes) Live and Learn
Thank God for free brake inspections. It took me all about 30 minutes to do it myself-part of that time was spent iacking the car up and taking off the wheels. They were planning on charging me $180 just to flip the shoes and replace "so called" necessary hardware.
Thanks for sharing the answer. I was actually thinking about this while I was driving in to work today!
Glad you are up and running.
Hmm, I'll have to double check my drums. I'm not even 100% sure that I have the right size shoes. There was a box of new shoes in the car when I bought it, and I installed them. (Old ones were down to the metal)
Thanks for keeping us updated
this is a brake bleeder helper,
Position the blade on the pedal after you pump it up, then bow it to catch under your wheel.
when you loosen the zirk fitting and bleed off brake fluid, the knife keeps the pedal to the floor for you.
yeah,, right,,
only if you drive backwards for two miles and slam on the brakes.
this never worked right with fords and it isnt just my opinion.
sounds to me you didnt learn your lesson.
You screw up by not paying attention wanting instant gratification and yet the professionals say you need some hardware ,,and yet your going to trust your 25 year old oem stuff over new cut hardware.
i have no clue how you got the two large shoes inside one drum,, i never tried it but i guess they fit.
glad you found the problem.
if you adjust the rear like chuck said, you will instantly notice the nose not dipping down.
Eventually when you see the nose is dipping down when braking, you know its time to adjust them again by hand.
I raise one wheel and put the car in N then adjust till i hear the pads rubbing while turning the wheel.
Next I turn the adjuster another click till the wheel cant move.
I drive it and the pads rub and cut themselves to fit the shape of my drum thus loosening up a little.
I didnt need to buy new hardware, The hardware was fine. The hardware I had in there was newer stuff. I'm one of those wierdo's who goes to the junk yard and collects all the newest parts I can find BEFORE I do a job, so just in case I end up working on the car late into the night, I dont have to travel anywhere for parts looking for the closest 24 hour parts store. Thats probably the other reason I didnt let him do the work. Basically he wanted me to pay $180 to flip two brake shoes. Aint gonna happen!
I did the adjustment like Chuck said, so I'm good to go. Thanks again guys!
Glad you got it fixed. One thing that comes to mind, if you got two 'big' shoes to fit in one side, you might want to check the drums to see if they're within spec.