Initially I set out to learn a bit more about oil for this upcoming oil change. Hoped to be a bit more informed so I could take the best possible care of my daily driver (the '86 V6) while on my very limited budget.
I ended up at the website, http://www.bobistheoilguy.com, where I found no end of hardcore fluid-changers who will even go so far as to send out for oil buttstuffysis both at the beginning and end of an OCI. Wow. Two entire wasted afternoons later, I was more confused than ever. About the only things I learned:
- Fram oil filters are going way downhill in quality (a seemingly unanimous opinion there) ever since Allied-Signal bought them.
- Wal-Mart brand oil filters (SuperTech) are most likely re-branded Purolators, and are actually very good quality at a decent price. ($2.07 for mine today, the second one I've used)
- Wal-Mart brand oil (again, SuperTech) appears to be re-branded major name oil with a generic additive package, and is actually pretty good oil for a house brand. The SuperTech Synthetic is supposed to be a fantastic deal at under $3 per quart or something like that.
EVERYTHING else seems to be up in the air over there.
Anyway, I finally decided I would just stick with my preferred brand, Valvoline.. but mess around a little bit. I picked up 5 qt. of MaxLife 5w30, and 1 qt. of MaxLife Synthetic 10w30. I had good results with the regular Valvoline 5w30 I ran in it over the "winter". :p Only lost something like half a quart over 3-4 months, and I think much of that leakage was due to parking on level ground again, (the rear main is known to leak on my '86.. but only when I park flat.. if the car leans to one side, the oil leaking stops) and I apparently didn't do a very good job of securing the oil filter last time. (didn't come off, but there was a bit more oil around it than the last oil change) I'm going to use the MaxLife once a year, and "normal" oil the rest of the time. Long story, and maybe my reasoning is flawed, but we'll see.
So to the point of the thread: How do you generally keep your older cars oiled? Are you a die-hard SAE 30 user, or do you hit the heavy stuff like 20w50, or go for the possible increases in mileage some people notice from lighter oils like 5w30? Cheap oil or good name brand? Synthetic or "dino" or blended? Homebrew mixes? Run it with whatever until it dies? Are you satisfied with your methods? Got any tips you'd like to share with the others here, while we're on the subject?
As an aside, do you use or plan to use any mechanical enhancements to your oiling system? What I mean is stuff like oil coolers, filter relocation kits, high capacity oil pans or even dry sump, aftermarket oil pump, etc. I'm considering my options there when it comes to all three cars.. and maybe some of the others here are as well.
, another long post. Blame the Vicodin and caffeine this time. :p
Well I'm probably gonna try out Castrol GTX on the cougar once I get around to the tuneup once it passes inspection.
I read awhile back on the oil choices on Mini Mopars a lil while back, It's got a overview of oil and oil filter choices.
(scroll to bottom)
http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/engine.html
In the cars: Summer: 10W30 Winter: 0W20 All Quaker State, NON synthetic
In my diesel truck: Summer: 15W40 Winter 5W30 Again Quaker State, Diesel Oil
I think that something as thick as 20W50 is only necessary in very high mileage engines with severe wear.
The father-in-law of one of my local friends uses 20w50 in EVERYTHING, and won't listen to anyone saying anything to the contrary. Ugh.
my moto,, change your oil once every other month needed or not. change tanny fluid once a year needed or not.
as for the thinner oils,, i think a lot of newer cars are calling out that and have so for some time now due to the tighter tolerances on bearings and such.
i look for an oil one day to appear the same viscosity as tranny fluid before long.
In my recent Oil change i had buy Supertech Oil 20W50. I dont have any idea, but i want to try a multigrade Oil with the cougar and, the price was good, but i have used Quaker State Sae 40 every time with good results. Practically in all the cars usually we use Sae 40, only in the F-150 we used Castrol Syntetic....
Your right about the thin oil trend. Most new Fords, for example, call for 5W20.
The only reason I use 0W20 in the winter is because of the temperatures. Once you get thicker than 5W?? the oil will not flow on those January mornings. In my truck, the thinnest I can run (without voiding warranty) is 5W??.
I guess 20W50 is ok in Flordia (cause its hot), although I would never put that sludge in my well maintained engines.
I have always used 10w-30 and a motorcraft filter
I use Valvoline Durablend 10W40 in my Cougar usually but am breaking in the new motor with regular Valvoline 10W40. I always use the Motorcraft FL1A filters on all my Fords. I use Havoline 10W40 in my 2.9 v6 Ranger pickup, its my second favorite oil
I used Havoline 10W40 in mine until the warranty ran out, then switched to straight 30W, with 3,000 mile changes, & Motorcraft filters only. The multi-grade stuff seemed to get thin after 2K or so, according to the gauge reading after a couple of minutes of autocrossing. Pressure would be down noticeably, but with fresh oil under the same conditions it would show no appreciable drop.
I never noticed this until a local racer pointed it out to me. The openings on the bottom of the motorcraft filters are oval and large compared to the other brands like fram and stp wich have more small holes. Oil wise I run Valvoline sae30 in the ranger in the summer and 10w30 in the winter. The cougar currantly has Coastal brand 10w30. She is starting to get a bit noisy so I'm going to switch to my favorite brand of oil, penziol but the high milage stuff. I dont like castrol, the stuff burns up in less than a 1000 miles. We have run penzoil for years. The stuff isn't bad at all.
Been running Penzoil semi synthetic in all my vehicles for a few years and would never use anything (especially a fram) other than a motocraft filter but since my rear main destroyed itself a couple months ago and the 255 isnt worth the work i've been running it on walmarts Tech 2000 20W-50, it doesnt even touch the dipstick (only about 1-2 L in it) but it still runs nice and quiet up to 4000 :D
Also walmarts oil and filters are made by who ever made the lowest bid at the time, i'm not sure how often they change suppliers but i'll check tomorrow and see if I can tell who supplies the oil. (Old Roy dog food is made by purina, but I didnt tell you ;) haha)
Running a K&N oil filter with valvoline maxlife 10w30 oil. I've run motorcraft oil once, my engine hated my guts. So no more of that. I'm deabating coverting to synthetic after I get the engine to stop bleeding like a stuck pig.
Awwww ! I just bought a whole case of Motorcraft synthetic blend oil! :slap:
Keep in mind I bought the $1.50 a quart bottles of non synthetic Motorcraft oil from Vato-zone. I don't think that it would be indicative of how their synthetic blend run in your car at all.
Fram oil filters suck. I've seen two engines blow with frams on them (Mitsu 2.0T and Ford 2.3). The oil pump on the mitsu seized, ripped the timing belt apart, bent valves and cracked a piston.
I used Motorcraft/Napa gold on my cars. They're both made by Wix, which is a very good filter.
I think I remember seeing that Walmart Synthetic came 2nd in an oil test, one down from Mobile 1.
After I brake my new engine in with 30wt. and 1000 miles of 10W30 I think I'm going to run some Royal Purple 10W30. I don't think you can go wrong with oil that costs $5.65 a qt.
Nick
Anybody have experiance with ams oil?
Fram WAS making good products till about 4 years ago. I use Purolator now. My oil of choice is Valvoline Durablend 10W40.
My daily drivers get Motorcraft filters, and Exxon or similar oil. What can I say, I have a hookup at AZ, baby. ;) The convertible gets nothing but Castrol Syntec Blend (3 quarts) and Castrol 10W30 (2 quarts) with a Bosch filter. The notion that synthetic oil does not cause leaks is baloney. If I run 5 quarts of regular Castrol, all my leaks disappear. There are all-new gaskets on the entire engine, and not cheap ones either. Most of my problems come from the oil pan drainplugs though. I'm going to try different gaskets for the magnetic drain plugs and see if that helps. I'd love to hold a full 5 quarts all summer long for a change..oh, and not clean up the spots on my garage floor either.
When I put the motor in the convertible in 1999, I'd installed a Melling high volume oil pump. My reasoning was that with the head work, roller rockers and higher-lift E-303 cam, I'd need more oiling power. Well, turned out that was a bad move. Twice I completely blew the oil filter off the car. The pressure relief valve in the oil pump was sticking on cold startup, and the weakest link is usually the filter. Had it not been for having some type of synthetic oil in the engine, I'm sure there would have been some damage to the engine. Instead I'm here 6+ years later with the same engine, no damage--and a regular Melling standard volume pump. This is real-world proof that synthetic oil is a good thing and worth the extra money.
In the past I've found Pennzoil to be very good for these engines (3.8 and 5.0, anyway). I've also substituted a quart of oil for a quart of Rislone. That is some wicked stuff. It's great for older-mileage engines but can also be used in lower-mileage ones. My dad used to use it back in the 1960's on his old '61 Corvette. He said one day he cracked open the engine (Chevy 283) at 200,000 miles and the inside looked like brand new. He put it back together, dropped it back into the car, and drove it many more miles before selling the car. I really believe in it and would recommend it. My old light blue '84 always had a quart of Rislone inside and it never failed me. A buddy of mine crosses the border to Mexico to visit his relatives, and he once sent me some stuff from Mexico that was similar to Rislone. It really quieted down the chatter in my old '88 XR7's engine. Can't remember the name of it but nice stuff. I'm not too familiar with any other products like that (Restore, etc.). Basically if it worked for my dad back in tha day, I use it, no questions asked.
ive been using castrol GTX in both of my birds, and have a motorcraft filter on the TC, and a fram on 3.8 (who cares about an old, beat up 3.8)
my dad ran GTX in his 89 3.8L, and his car burned it up quick, he's been running Penzoil since probably the 80's in his cars
So I am not alone on this one eh......I was getting one or two drops on the garage floor when it sat a week or 10 days.....Just put in new plugs with a drop of thread sealer on the threads so far so good
So that's where some of this oil is coming from. . Well, another 3000-ish miles before I can do much about it, I guess. (unless I let some of it out in a quick switch-out of plugs and gaskets, and pour it back in.. but I'd rather not. I don't lose that much oil, maybe half a quart per oil change)
I thought the gasket felt a little stiff and maybe even brittle, when I did the last change.. but I didn't think it would be too bad.
Maybe it isn't really the rear main seal.. but it still could be.
i used vavoline since i started changing my oil. in the cougar 10-40 in the summer and 5-40 in the winter. but when i used to take it to jiffy lube. they started sythetic. and i didnt like it to much also started leaking. no more of that in an old motor for me.
mustang i use the same 10-40 valvoline oil and motorcraft filters. when i got the car in the winter it had one of those fram Extra fiter garbage on it. and you could hear it starve the motor for oil on first startup. not to good if you ask me .
I have the same starvation on the blue bird, and it too has a POS Fram filter on it.... Gonna pull the pan and get rid of the high volume pump in it and check the bearings. Then it will get Motorcraft filter and synthetic blend. I use nothing but Motorcraft filter and 5w-30 synthetic blend in the white bird. Wifes 100K mi Grand Marquis gets Valvoline high milage 5w-30 in the winter and 10w-40 in the summer(also with Motorcraft filter). It uses a little oil as the valve stem seals are starting to go, since they are such a bitch to change in a 4 fuggin' point 6, I'll just keep addin oil for now.
As far as oil, most brands are probably just fine... Years ago I had a 100K mi '69 351 Windsor in a '67 Falcon. Every time I changed the oil I bought a different brand, just to see if it made a difference. Guess it was a really good motor cause it never really cared what was in it. Finally junked the car and sold the engine(with approx 150K) to a guy for a Mustang.
forgot about that :crazy: walmart brand oil is supplied by Safety Kleen which from my quick searches appears to be an oil recycler. If anyone cares... also mobile one and esso are both by imperial and penzoil/quaker state are the same, I never knew that.
"Amsoil"? Only the the rec.autos.tech newsgroup where they call it Scamsoil.
Here's a blurb I found with a quick search:
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API Certification, Phosphorus & ZDDP Never use a non-API certified synthetic oil (there are many of these on the market). The problem with the non-API certified synthetics is that they contain too much phosphorus (in the form of the additive ZDDP (Zinc Dialkyl Dithiophosphates)). The API has limited the amount of phosphorus because phosphorus shortens the life of the catalytic converter. These oils are fine for snowmobiles, motorcycles, and older cars that don't have a catalytic converter, and the extra ZDDP does provide additional wear protection. Unfortunately, the marketers of some the non-certified oils do not explicitly and honestly state the reason for the lack of API certification. You can check the status of API certification on the API web site. Be certain to go not just by the manufacturer name but by the actual product as well. This is because a manufacturer will sometimes have both certified and non-certified products. Suffice it to say that Mobil 1, Royal Purple, Castrol, & Havoline all make synthetic oils that are API certified and that can be purchased at auto parts stores and other retail outlets.
Amsoil has one product line, XL-7500 that is API certified, but it's other lines contain too much ZDDP to be certified and should not be used in vehicles with catalytic converters.
AmsoilAmsoil actually makes some very good products. The negative image of Amsoil is due to their distribution method (MLM) and their marketing approach. If Amsoil products were competitively priced with Mobil 1 and other synthetics, and if I could buy them in a store, I would not hesitate to use their XL-7500 synthetic as opposed to Mobil 1. What upsets me about Amsoil is that they didn't disclose until recently (and then it was by accident) the real reason that their oils (except for XL-7500) are not API certified. In the past they came up with all sorts of bizarre excuses about the reason for their lack of API certification and this greatly contributed to the distrust that people have of the company.
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OK, oil's NOT well that ends well, because now I am getting an occasional knocking when warm and at low speed. I've decided to try a thicker oil, and consider the 500 miles I got out of this oil change to be a flushing of the system. (whatever eases the pain.. heh)
This time around I plan on using 4 qt. of 10w40 MaxLife, and 1 qt. of 5w30 MaxLife Synthetic. Also picked up a Motorcraft FL-1A for this change. We'll see how it goes.. I'll probably put it in tomorrow if the weather cooperates.
OK, it's 4:21 in the morning and I'm stuck awake and researching oil filters out of sheer boredom.
It looks like the FL-1A/PH8A/etc. is the gold standard in oil filters. So much the better for us, huh? However, they look to have a bypass valve that opens generally in the 8-11 PSI range.. with some brands reporting as high as 16 PSI. But according to here:
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=6;t=002510#000003
..and here:
http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy-mopar.html#m53020311
..it's apparently possible to get one with a 30 PSI bypass valve, but people should be picky about which one they go after. (The Wix 51191 (http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/results.asp?PartNo=51191&imageField.x=25&imageField.y=16) sounds like a decent candidate.. even though it does not officially list any of our engines under the application guide, compare the measurements)
So this begs the question, which would you rather have?
Awww quit ' arround with that watery stuff, you have a rather worn engine there. Get some 20W-50(it will be fine in sunny FL, I still use it in my old Cobra Jet) and the Motorcraft filter. If you still have problems its time for a overhaul..
Hey guys,
I noticed several references to Wal-Mart. Don't get me wrong, I love the store most of the time, but they are about to lose my oil-changing business (I'm sure they'll miss me). First, my local Wal-Mart dropped the oil I've used in my '98 F150 for the last 3 years, Castrol Synthetic Blend 5W-30. They still carry Castrol, and they still carry other weights of Castrol Synthetic blends, but not 5W-30. OK, I can deal with that. Then, and I don't know if this applies to every Wal-Mart or just the ones I shop at, they dropped all brands of filters except Fram (oil, air, fuel, etc.). What did Fram or whoever owns them now have to pay Wally World to pull that off? I almost refuse to put Fram oil filters in my vehicles. It's got to be Motorcraft. When I first started getting on F150 forums several years ago, the topic of oil filters came up all the time, and what I remember them saying was that, Frams don't or didn't use to have anti-drainback valves in them. That means, when the motor is shut off, all of the oil drains back into the pan. Motorcrafts have the valve (which you'd expect them to, being OEM). So starting your truck/car with a Fram meant you were running a dry motor for a short period of time (not good); Motorcraft, oil still up in motor, motor happier! From that point, all I have bought is Motorcraft. I guess I have to find a new store to buy from. Watch for Wal-Mart stock prices to plummet dramatically!! Just thought I'd warn you. Thanks for letting me vent.
Fordman3
Motorcraft filters are apparently designed and built by Purolator, although they claim otherwise on the box.
From what I gather on that BITOG site, Motorcrafts cause a pretty significant drop in oil pressure compared to many of the other filters. I'll still give this FL-1A a try, though. But I'm thinking about tracking down one of these Wix filters with the 30 PSI bypass valve.
And yes, Wal-Mart is going all-Fram now.. apparently even getting rid of their own SuperTech brand soon.
Oh yeah, Tom: Already bought the oil, yesterday afternoon. Gotta work with what I have for now. I could always just leave out the quart of synthetic and go all 10w40. Anyway, if I grenade this engine, I'll just switch its tag over to the '88 since I've been promised a new fuel pump once this financial mess (from the $3600 repair bill on the ZX2) is sorted out. Then the CFI 3.8 would eventually go bye-bye in favor of the carbed 351W. I don't WANT to grenade the engine.. but if it happens, it happens.. and I'll have a plan in place to deal with it.
Walmart. Ugh!
I always try to get my oil and filters at carquest, always use Motorcraft filters, and usually trop artic or castrol, but lately (past 3 changes) I've been using Castrol high mileage oil in the truck.
With 300,000 miles on it...it's getting weak.
Well, live and learn, people. I got screwed.
Turns out the 10w40 bottle I bought was a gallon, when every other Valvoline MaxLife large bottle I've ever seen is 5 qt. No wonder it was 50 cents cheaper than the 5 qt. of 5w30 MaxLife I bought at Wally-World ~600 miles ago. Good thing I had the extra quart of synthetic on hand. Think from now on I'll try to buy by the case. Won't pile up for long with three cars to take care of.
I drained it.. dumped a little less than half a quart of fresh 5w30 dino down it that was left over from the last change, for a quick and dirty flushing.. put a new plug and gasket (plastic this time.. go fig) on the drain hole. Now it has a FL-1A (pre-filled it some of the fresh 5w30 synthetic) and mostly 10w40. Max oil pressure is a bit lower this time around, (between 55 and 60 now, was over 62 before at cold startup) but the minimum oil pressure under warm idle/load is at least 5 PSI higher. I get probably around 30-35 PSI at 50 mph in OD, when warm. Now to see if the knocking returns on extended trips around town, tomorrow.