Hey every one, I was looking for advise/help on repairing the rust on my car on an other forum and daminc suggested I hang out here as well.
All though its not a Fox, its a 91 tbird. The floor boards need to be replaced and the outer rockers also. I think I have a good grasp on what I need to do but this will be my first major project like this with me doing most of the work alone. So I would love to hear any advise or wisdom you guys have.
I took 13 new photo's tonight from under the car, the Main rails I think are OK, the rear of the car might need some more work were the IRS is attached to. But that will give me a reason to beef that up anyway. Has any one taking the dash out of these cars? I can not get those vents that go under the seats removed with out the dash out. I have removed 4 (2 8mm and 2 10mm) on the top of the dash from behind trim panels, then 2 on each side near the doors (10mm i think) then two 8mm from the center on the tunnel. The only thing I have not done yet is disconnect the steering shaft because I need a longer extension. Could this be why? The dash is loose but I feel like there is something else in the middle still connected.
Here are the photo's as of date. I'll try to keep this updated with my progress.
http://s260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/?albumview=slideshow&newest=1 (http://"http://s260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/?albumview=slideshow&newest=1")
So how long was it parked waist deep in a lake? :D
Stuff like this makes me incredibly glad I live in a rustless state.
HAHA.... for about 3 years its been under water :) no actually its just been on the side of two different house's for the past 3 years. I lived in an apartment for 4 years so I couldn't do any work on it so it sat at my dad's until last year when I bought a house.
I have a 5.0 that actually came out of a 86 cougar that I will be putting in the 91 also. I really miss that cougar
Get a Fox...:D
Good luck with the repairs. I am interested to see how it all goes. Parts shouldnt be too hard to find for you which should help. Hope it all goes well.
yep, that looks familiar.
welcome aboard. we'll help you get things running smooth. Whether it's panel fixin of motor swapping, someone here will probably know the answer.
there's a bunch of ways to do sub frame connectors, which you may consider first as long as the floor is that bad.
Next I would see what parts you would need as far as replacements. You can go here and find out where you can locate some panels. just be sure to call before you go on your journey. sometimes the database doesn't get updated.
http://car-part.com/ (http://"http://car-part.com/")
If that doesn't pan out, post an add in the parts needed section. a lot of us go to the yards for fox parts. and the newer cars are there as well.
There's also a place in Canada near Toronto, that I wanted to check out. there supposed to have all kinds of cougar parts from 67 and up.
here's another one
http://www.automotix.net/partshotline-ford-thunderbird-quarter_panel-requests.html (http://"http://www.automotix.net/partshotline-ford-thunderbird-quarter_panel-requests.html")
or try to find one that was front ended
Welcome to the site dude. That right there is midwest rust, thank god mine isn't that bad. I wish you luck.
thanks guys I'll keep you posted
Thanks I'll Keep it updated. What are you meaning when you say sub frame connectors? I have a few Ideas but want to make sure we are talking about the same thing.
When they talk about subframe connectors they mean something that ties the front subframe to the rear subframe to solidify the entire car. This will improve its stiffness and remove the flex.
I was so worried about the strength of the car being compromised by rust and replacement panels, that I decided to install these after making them. I may have gone a little overboard, but no one will say that the frame gave out after repairing the rest. LOL
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/Cougar%20Pass%20side%20rebuild/frame%20rails%20and%20connectors/IMG_4089.jpg)
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/Cougar%20Pass%20side%20rebuild/frame%20rails%20and%20connectors/IMG_4101.jpg)
and as you can see in my sig. it works very well to support the weight of the car with out bending or flexing.
I see. And you just welded that in place all down the line then?
what I circled from your pic, on mine it has rusted out and only the top floor board remains now.(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/Temp/IMG_4101copy.jpg)
if you look on my thread, You'll see that I replaced that too. Mine was gone also. ;)
I was trying to look threw it. I know I saw where you installed those...after almost 200 pages it gets time consuming lol.
Here, this might be easier.There's more organization this way.
And there's also sub directories.
http://s233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/ (http://"http://s233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/")
I also came across a 90s bird at the pick n pull today with no rust on it. the front was wiped out
They probably wouldn't sell the body huh? And I know they wont let you bring a torch with ya haha. if I can get the rear quarters and floor I would be set. I would like to spend no more then 200? I am guessing really. I found a 94 in Iowa for $150 with a blown up 4.6 but 8 hours is a long haul with a car trailer. I don't even know if its still for sale, it was listed back in February
Well guess what? I live in iowa ;) and know where you can get a tbird MN12 with a 4.6 with a junk tranny.
So what are ya proposing? :D all I want is the body. I don't know enough about the 4.6 Since I have the 5.0 and know a little more about it being more old school. what kind of shape is the body in?
I would sleep better at night If I found a new body that was rear ended or had front damage ( so I could justify cutting it up :D )
It was owned by a buddy of mine in college and it was in rough shape paint wise. Its not very pretty but I think it would fit the bill for what you are looking for. I'll have to see if he'd want to part with it. He actually just sold a Supercoupe that was in the same situation recently. I'll give him a call and see if I can find anything out.
Yeah as long as there is no rust... see what he says
I really don't know if they would let me take a sawzall to the side of it. I suppose I could call to find out. you just need the lower panels right?
for the rear quarters yes. In front of the rear tires, from molding down. This will show you what area I need, that's the new rocker I have but it only covers so much area.
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/ThunderBird/P5020066.jpg)
The inner rockers I may be able to fab like you did. I will be getting a sandblaster this week so I can start finding were the good metal starts again. I am thinking just straight sheet metal can fix the floor boards. I need to figure out exactly where the body mounts are. I know there are two near the rear wheels and are fairly exposed at the moment so I might have to box those areas back in with sheet metal. I think all the other mounts are OK (rusted out wise) The driver side A pillar and the rear where the IRS bolts up are the two areas I am nervous about. I wont be able to get the car in the air completely till next week ether so I haven't really been able to look real well near the back of the car.
In all honesty, if I can get away with not using a donor car I would be happy...except for the outer sheet metal of course. By the way, I gave up getting the dash out. I'm just going to cut the vents and tape the cut with foil tape when I put it back together.... its just vents for the rear passengers anyway lol
I decided to go ahead and remove the dash...sort of. I have it all loose but I will leave it in because of the wiring harness, I just don't want to deal with that head ache.
So I got my dad's welder and sand blaster, I need an adapter for the hose on his air compressor because he has it set up at home differently. So I was getting antsy and wanted to weld, well I couldn't get a good ground I think for the wire to even feed so then I decided to remove the fender I was going to weld on so I could make sure I had good contact and all. I was going to replace the fender anyway.
Good thing I decided to do all that because yes... you guessed it I found more rust. I think now I should wait till I get the engine out and I might just end up striping every thing down like ic has done. I might end up with a "Project Evolution" after all. You cant see it in the first pic but on the wall to the right is the grill from our old cougar. I saved it and now its on my wall.... just thought you guys would feel all warm and fuzzy knowing that lol
You know when I pulled that fender off I did feel pretty bummed and was getting really discouraged...
here are the pics. sorry that they are so big and blurry
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/P5120091.jpg)
this is near the firewall on the driver side engine bay
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/P5120092.jpg)
the other side of that same area
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/P5120093.jpg)
directly above the tire inside
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/P5120094.jpg)
I know how you feel. I thought my car was going to be a little welding and body work a year and a half ago. You'll also find yourself upgrading things as you go. It's a good time for all that extra bracing ,welding and supports as well.;)
You may want to find yourself a parts car that you can cut sections off of. it may be easier then trying to make some of the stuff you need.
Welcome to the rebuild support group. As long as you think of it as a total rebuild project instead of a quick fix, you'll be alright.
I know it! The only thing I am worried about with a parts car is where to put it. Having a full car on the side of the house is one thing but I still live in a subdivision and I don't know how they would feel with a gutted and chopped up car there. The strut tower area is the only real place I am not sure about. I have wondered how it would be to replace the whole engine bay area from front bumper to firewall. The radiator support was bent a little and I straighten it out with a torch the best I could a few years ago after a deer did a somersault over my roof.
What would be better, get the motor out first then do any metal work? or do the floors and/or rockers then pull the motor and other metal work?
I left my motor in while I did the floor, rockers and quarters and everything else that didn't require removing the motor and gas tank, only so I can still move it and turn it around. Pulling the motor, would be your call depending on how far up the firewall you need to replace metal.
Do you have a garage to do your work in?
Yes. Its sitting in there now, the garage is "technically" a two car garage, but its more like a one car garage with room to work around in. I have that 5.0 sitting on a stand to go in the bird (still need to finish putting that together). The motor will be coming out at some time. I think I will just do a little of both...work on the floor and get the motor ready to be pulled.
As of right now I don't think the actual firewall needs to be replaced, its the side walls that connect to the firewall that has the rust. If I cut out small sections (the size of the rust) and replace it I should be ok with keeping things still strong and lining up? like around the strut towers... there is small areas of rust and I don't want those places to get misaligned and not able to drive down the road straight.
Is it the top rail part that's rotted?
I guess thats what it would be called. But its not rotted on top, just on the sides and underneath. Maybe this pic would explain it better
(http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii18/agutsechicken/ThunderBird/P5140098copy.jpg)