So iwas searching the forums, and got confused on the whole head situation, I want to put better heads on the so block, without having to go through pulling a cam and an entire top end out at a junkyard. Is it possible to just change the heads, or would i have to swap the entire top end... eg throttle body/ intake, and cam??? I can probably get this stuff cheap, but i want to drive my car ASAP!!!!! Thanks!!!!
I would think that if you change to gt40 or gt40p you would also have to change the upper and lower, but don't quote me on this as i'm not 100% on this, just from what I've learned on the forums.
You don't have to change the intake,but,you really should.Also,the cam,and if you're running GT-40 heads and a performance cam,you may need pistons with valve reliefs.The flat tops may smack the valves.
The stock unported intake is a bottleneck on the E7 heads; why on earth would you want to use it with anything that flows more?
you are gonna run into to many problems attempting to use the better heads on your SO engine unless it has been converted to mass air FI. Demon is right....it's just like putting headers on with the stock exhaust pipes.....There will not be much of a difference. Why don't you try the HO upper intake and throttle body on the stock SO motor. It will make a difference that is quite noticeable. Use a good air filter and play with the timing and TPS. Maybe some underdrive pulleys. This will cost you much less in cash and down time for the performance gains noticed by what you re wanting to do.
Now could you put GT40P heads on an HO motor? I was thinking of going GT40P heads and an E303 cam.
Yes except for the header issues.
Well yeah I know that. but should I have any issues if I go that route?
Are you changing your intake?
With what trans and rear gear?
FWIW -- I'd keep the stock HO cam and throw some 1.7 rockers on with those heads -- ESPECIALLY if I were running an auto trans.
Add to that an Explorer intake and a free flowing exhaust and you have a solid and prove setup that won't destroy your wallet.
First things first...is the car mass air or not? If not you will have too many problems trying to sort out the fuel injection with the combo you want. If the car is still SO and you do not want to break the bank, try the HO intake, stock HO cam and TB with some headers and exhaust. You will need a stock Speed Density computer from a mustang to make this combo work. If it is still a stock SO setup with speed density, this will be your best combo unless you change to mass air FI. The best would be to find a stock HO motor and computer from a 86-88 mustang. This would be the quickest and easiest for you If you want to change to Mass Air, I have a write up that I did a LONG time ago that will help you with that, but then you will be forking out a ton of cash and down time to make the complete change over.
Let me know where you stand as far as FI system and where you want to get to and all these guys can recommend the best changes to make. We just need to know a few more details for a good way ahread...right now we are assuming you are Mass Air FI, and if that is not the case there are quite a few differences.
Okay, I'm not going EFI at first, I was thinking of going to a T-5 and my car has 3.73's in it already. Exhaust would be pretty easy to get done. Think the E cam is a bit too much cam? I'm no engine builder so I go by what you guys suggest.
FWIW plenty of people have run aftermarket heads with the HO speed density setup.
Tom (TurboCoupe50) had an aftermarket head 5.0 TC with the SD ECU. I can't remember if he had a cam in that particular car or not...
No. Most people who switch to them -- ESPECIALLY on an E7 headed motor -- see no gains. The power comes, but too late to make a difference and it takes too much away early on.
Plenty of people have swapped an e-cam into an E7 headed motor and gone slower. If you're really looking to do the e-cam I'd get a set of upgraded springs for safety measures and install the cam with 4 degrees advance.
Trick Flow makes a set of upgrade springs for the stock style heads (E6, E7, Gt40) for about $135....
Crane makes a set too at least I think they will if they reopen -- either way Summit sells them, LOL
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=CRN-44308-1&N=700+115&autoview=sku
The spring rate is 455 pounds/inch though.....Probably overkill for an e-cam, but not detrimental.
The E-cam will give you more, no matter what head you got on.
It just needs a little more air to make it breath, and a gear you already got.
What do you have now?, starting to sound like your bustin are balls.
If you are going to run GT40P heads don't run them with the stock SO or HO intake. I ran my engine for a year with the stock HO upper and I didn't realize how much power it choked off till I put a GT40 intake on.
If you are just going to put GT40P heads on a stock SO engine I wouldn't bother. The rest of the system is a bottle neck and the heads will not make any more power than what you have. Plus I'm really not sure if the valves will clear the stock T-bird pistons. You'd have to set up everything, get your valve timing correct, and then clay it to make sure it clears.
Well I'm not busting your balls, just curious. I want to get a pretty good engine built here and I'm no engine pro. I just haven't had the experience some of you have had thats why I ask. If you prefer I could build an engine and complain when it didn't work? I wouldn't want to bust your balls.
Naahhh wasn't any cam in that motor, increase HP by removing frictional losses... :hick:
OK, it had a stock HO cam, Windsor Jr heads, ported HO intake(had been cut and rewelded), a 65mm TB, BBK 1515 headers into a X pipe and full 2 1/2" exhaust sysem... The car had a Ford racing Mass Conversion, but run about the same on a '88 SD Stang EEC... Was peppy, but no match for my Trick Flow headed & cammed 5.0... To be fair, it only had a stock torque converter and 3:55 gears, but even at 3K, it still didn't pull anything like my car...
As long as you don't change the stock HO cam out and use heads that the stock 19lb injectors can handle (ie your combo doesn't make over ~300 hp-ish) SD will run fine with those mods. I ran my combo with SD for a year but the idle problems were starting to bugg me so I switched to MAF. Runs much better now ;)
He said he was going carb, that's why I asked what he's running now. since it's an SO, Ho conversion would be the best swap for now. with the E cam your going into dangerous territory with e-7 heads let alone gt-40's.
He should run the stock HO cam over the e cam for other reasons I stated above anyway....
One day I'll fashion a lamp out of an e-cam...
Does that mean you want to buy mine? I can send an extra lamp shade with it! lol
Perhaps :hick:
It WOULD be the best use of an e cam...LOL!
It runs great in mine, I will see how much it didn't soon.
Well, thanks I guess?
ok, so iwent to the jy in search of some heads, And the only car i could find with a 5.0 in it was a lincoln mark. i dont know whick Vii or whatever..........most of the top end was gone , well fuel rails, injectors, tb, and intake nameplate........well,,,,, i feel like a moron, cause i just saw t bird guy trying to sell his mark, And it has an HO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I got the wrong heads!!!!!! I think...... the block i got the heads from had valve relifes on the pistons, so they definately wont work on my block huh? I only paid $55 for both headsd with rods, rockers, and hedders, and some cool aluminum valve covers. If i could get some more info on what cars i can find the rest of the ho stuff in, that would be awsome!!! i dont get paid for another week, so i have some time to scrounge,if any one has some ho stuff for sale for a reasonable price, please let me know, you can post here or pm mme.... oh yeah, the heads i got only had 85k on the motor, so i might go pick the cam out of it too, ....pics and update later on......
Well now all you need is the short block. Check the cast numbers on the heads, should say something around the lines of E7TE.
the only numbers i can find are 9k10
If the heads came from a Mark VII,they will work fine on your 5.0,even if your car doesn't have valve reliefs.As long as you're using the H.O cam,no worries.
pics up now, these are the heds i got, its only a pic of the casting numbers and the hedders n valve covers.....
(http://[IMG]http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp346/Mean88Merc/Cougars/DSCN2359.jpg)[/IMG]
(http://[IMG]http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp346/Mean88Merc/Cougars/DSCN2362.jpg)[/IMG]
(http://[IMG]http://i426.photobucket.com/albums/pp346/Mean88Merc/Cougars/DSCN2363.jpg)[/IMG]
ill post up some more when everythings all cleaned up!!!!!!!
They're fine.You're good to go.I'd install some valve seals.They're cheap and easy to change.
i got a complete upper gasket set for 80 bucks, and it came with stem seals n stuff, but the ho heads are different i suppose.......
The upper kit will still work the same.You're good.When you swap the heads,make sure the mating surfaces of the heads and block are SUPER clean.Take your time and prep everything the right way.Don't get in a hurry,or you may end up doing the job twice.Oh,pics will be needed throughout the process.Sorry,it's the rules.
Yes sir!!!! pics will go up as it gets done, and as i aquire parts......the last thing i want is to go through all this and have to s it all........
Go back for the cam. Nice job! 85,000 get the block.
The short block would be nice if it fits your budget.
The E7TE, is on the underside of the head.
Don't forget the 88 and up Mark VIIs came with E7 heads. The 86-87 Mark VIIs with a HO came with the same py E6 heads these cars had stock ;)
you can also get the heads off a fuel injected 5.0 ford truck and 91-93 cougars/thunderbirds as well as any 87-95 mustang. I would be looking at explorers if I was going to do a whole engine. Just drop it in and slap your timing cover on and go.Better heads, intake, and should be the same basic block as a mustang. Then you just need the cam.
I already have the cam, gt40 intake (non tubular im betting), 1.7 rockers, and lifters on the way as we speak, the hedders are getting sandblasted and powdercoated, the valve covers are getting polished, and the intake will be painted or polished...... the only things i need now are the computer and injectors.........(and install all this stuff) the new thread will be on the way as soon as my parts are gathered, so ill keep you posted,.....
On a side note........ actually being able to get out and work on my car has me so pumped,....i think its gunna be pretty sweet!!!! the last time i drove it, it had a bad trans that slipped in every gear, has a really leaky ps pump, burnt valves, dont know how many yet, taken aprt dash and mismatched fenders and colors...hell.... i couldnt even get the tire to spin on a rainy day,.... i know driving the car is going to put the biggest cheesiest smile on my face,.........
i cant wait!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Maybe a tranny is in order too?
already have one.......:shakeass: with Bout 27k on it.....,..... i know the block would be nice,... but with all the stuff im doing, the block would probably only go for like 60 bucks,...... a full motor is only $180 with a 90 day warranty........ so maybe sometime down the rooad, illl just pick one up, for parts or sale ...... idk....