Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 08:12:09 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 08:12:09 PM
Ive been contemplating whether i should replace the struts in my car myself(front only), or pay the mechanic shop 416 dollars (again,front only). Ive never done any type of suspension work before so i dont really know what i would be getting into, and i havent researched it much yet because i dont want to waste my time if its too much of a challenge. So, my question to you guys is, is there anything in particular that is really challenging about it?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 08:58:10 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 08:58:10 PM
I just put some on my 88 sport. Do it yourself and save the money. There is nothing to it, 2 bolts on the bottom and one nut on top. Just put a jack stand under the control arm to keep the spring compressed and you shouldn't have any problems. I had to take the rotor off to get the bottom bolt out. I left the strut mount on and just took the nut off the top of the strut and it slides out.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:05:15 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:05:15 PM
Ok, so you would jack the car itself first right? Would i put the jackstand under the spring before i started unbolting the strut?
Im guessing it slides out of the top? Sorry so many question, i wanna make sure i understand how to do this, the online manual at autozone is confusing as hell.
Quote
I left the strut mount on and just took the nut off the top of the strut and it slides out.
__________________
Im guessing it slides out of the top? Sorry so many question, i wanna make sure i understand how to do this, the online manual at autozone is confusing as hell.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: t3skidoo on February 15, 2009, 09:06:41 PM
Post by: t3skidoo on February 15, 2009, 09:06:41 PM
+1
It's one of the easiest things to do. Put the car on stands, pull the front wheels, pop the hood, loosen the two bolts/nuts on the spindle, loosen the retaining nut at the top of the strut, use a floor jack to support the control arm, then remove the nuts, bolts, strut. Just don't strip any threads! And watch your knuckles around the spindles.
It's one of the easiest things to do. Put the car on stands, pull the front wheels, pop the hood, loosen the two bolts/nuts on the spindle, loosen the retaining nut at the top of the strut, use a floor jack to support the control arm, then remove the nuts, bolts, strut. Just don't strip any threads! And watch your knuckles around the spindles.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:08:20 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:08:20 PM
Quote from: 20thanniver-ls;256997
Ok, so you would jack the car itself first right? Would i put the jackstand under the spring before i started unbolting the strut?
yes jack the car up put a jack stand under the spring on the control arm
Quote
Im guessing it slides out of the top? Sorry so many question, i wanna make sure i understand how to do this, the online manual at autozone is confusing as hell.
it slides out the bottom
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:11:07 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:11:07 PM
Yea that sounds wicked easy lol. When supporting the control arms i just raise the jack just enough so when i unbolt the strut completley and take it out the spring dosent come out?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Chuck W on February 15, 2009, 09:11:10 PM
Post by: Chuck W on February 15, 2009, 09:11:10 PM
That top nut will most likely require an impact gun to get it off there. You're not going to just twist it off with a ratchet.
The two spindle bolts will probably require a little heat in addition to the impact to get them loose.
The two spindle bolts will probably require a little heat in addition to the impact to get them loose.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:14:00 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:14:00 PM
Quote
That top nut will most likely require an impact gun to get it off there. You're not going to just twist it off with a ratchet.
Ive got a dewalt electric impact, its not pnuematic but it should work.
Quote
The two spindle bolts will probably require a little heat in addition to the impact to get them loose
Got that covered as well thanks for the advice;)
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:14:21 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:14:21 PM
Quote from: Chuck W;257003
That top nut will most likely require an impact gun to get it off there. You're not going to just twist it off with a ratchet.
The two spindle bolts will probably require a little heat in addition to the impact to get them loose.
Thats what i had to do.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:20:27 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:20:27 PM
Ok, I dont want to sound like a moron but....
1. Jack up car, remove wheels, support control arm.
2. Loosen top bolt and two bottom bolts, reomve strut.
3. Slide in new strut, tighten bolts.
4. Lower control arm support, put tires on, lower car.
Just want to be sure thats all ther is to it....
1. Jack up car, remove wheels, support control arm.
2. Loosen top bolt and two bottom bolts, reomve strut.
3. Slide in new strut, tighten bolts.
4. Lower control arm support, put tires on, lower car.
Just want to be sure thats all ther is to it....
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:25:20 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:25:20 PM
You got it
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:28:58 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:28:58 PM
Thanks for the inspiration guys, gonna get it done next weekend. Probably shoulda asked this firrst, but how do you know if the struts are bad? When i go over bumps i hear like a clanging noise when my tires go up and down. I had this problem once before on another car (93 cougar) thought it was the control arms but that wasnt it, so im thinking struts. Sound about right?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:34:31 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:34:31 PM
Yea thats most likely a bad strut.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:37:23 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:37:23 PM
Is there any torque spec for the bolts or is it just as tight as i can get them?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:47:19 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 15, 2009, 09:47:19 PM
Just make them tight I wouldnt worry bout torque.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:51:10 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 15, 2009, 09:51:10 PM
Cool, thanks for the help
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 05:38:43 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 05:38:43 PM
OK, I dont know if i should have started a new thread for this, but how do you tell if the struts are bad? I get a clanging noise in my front end sometimes when i go over bumps in the road, and sometimes it happens on clean paved road??? I have talked to some mechanics and have about narrowed it down to either the struts or the ball joints. Is there any way to distinguish which could be the problem?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:18:14 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:18:14 PM
I took my tire off and took some pictures of the upper ball joints, lower ball joints, and of something that i have no clue what it is but it looks like it may be either the problem or a problem.
upper ball joints/control arms
upper ball joints/control arms
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:19:54 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:19:54 PM
Lower ball joints
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:20:56 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:20:56 PM
And this picture i have no idea what it is but it looks bad...
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:22:40 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 06:22:40 PM
Its the two torn up bushings - one on the top by the brake line and one on the bottom connected by that rod. I have no idea what it is, I do know it seems to be connedcted to the swaybar though.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:07:23 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:07:23 PM
Anybody know?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Chooglin on February 18, 2009, 08:12:45 PM
Post by: Chooglin on February 18, 2009, 08:12:45 PM
stabilizer bar link?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:19:05 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:19:05 PM
It seems to be connected to the sway bar and the bottom part of the strut im completly clueless
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 08:31:58 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 08:31:58 PM
Quote from: 20thanniver-ls;257555
And this picture i have no idea what it is but it looks bad...
This looks like your sway bar links. The bushings do look pretty bad. If the sway bar is really loose its possible that it could be hitting something whenever you go over bumps and making the noise you hear.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:36:42 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 08:36:42 PM
Well sometimes it happens even when i dont go over bumps, it kinda feels like the wheels start to shake and i hear the noise......is that bar supposed to be able to be moved freely by hand? I can turn it back and forth with my hand.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 18, 2009, 08:45:43 PM
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 18, 2009, 08:45:43 PM
It is tough to tell from your pics but you may have a bad sway bar end link. Bad ball joint, a possible source of clunk noise. Above all DO NOT undo your top strut nut without something to hold that spring. The advice you were given was for a fox car. The car you are working on has a different design, and the strut is holding the spring under compression. Loosen the nut the retaining the spring pressure and that spring may hurt you very badly, or worse.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 08:52:12 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 08:52:12 PM
Quote from: mjbtbrd;257581
The advice you were given was for a fox car. The car you are working on has a different design, and the strut is holding the spring under compression. Loosen the nut the retaining the spring pressure and that spring may hurt you very badly, or worse.
+2 I think we all thought you was talking about ur cougar and not the new bird. anyways..
Here is what ur sway bar link should look like and it shouldnt be able to be moved by your hand or at least mine doesnt.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 18, 2009, 08:56:04 PM
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 18, 2009, 08:56:04 PM
Quote from: 20thanniver-ls;257580
Well sometimes it happens even when i dont go over bumps, it kinda feels like the wheels start to shake and i hear the noise.....
You are describing a symptom of a bad ball joint. If the wheel feels loose under you when you are driving.
If you doubt your ability to diagnose a ball joint have it checked. If it really is very bad the wheel may detach from the suspension when driving if the ball joint fails.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:00:48 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:00:48 PM
Well the ball joints *looked* like they are in pretty good shape when i took the wheel off, and i know that the strut has been replaced, and the sway bar link looks like . It moves very easily and the bushings are pushed all the way in.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:03:45 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:03:45 PM
Quote
+2 I think we all thought you was talking about ur cougar and not the new bird. anyways..
Sorry bout that
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:04:30 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:04:30 PM
Is the sway bar link something pretty easy to replace?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 18, 2009, 09:06:25 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 18, 2009, 09:06:25 PM
I'm betting on the stabilizer link. They went bad in my MN12 and the noise was enough to drive a man to drink.
With the MN12 bad ball joints are easy enough to diagnose: With the front end of the car supported by the frame (NOT the lower control arm - let the suspension hang) grab the tire at 12 and 6 o'clock. Try to move the tire back and forth. If you get play you've probably got a bad ball joint. If it's the upper that's bad you should be able to see the spindle move in relation to the control arm. If it's the lower you might need some help - have somebody else move the tire while you look for movement at the lower joint.
That stabilizer link is almost certainly your noise though...
With the MN12 bad ball joints are easy enough to diagnose: With the front end of the car supported by the frame (NOT the lower control arm - let the suspension hang) grab the tire at 12 and 6 o'clock. Try to move the tire back and forth. If you get play you've probably got a bad ball joint. If it's the upper that's bad you should be able to see the spindle move in relation to the control arm. If it's the lower you might need some help - have somebody else move the tire while you look for movement at the lower joint.
That stabilizer link is almost certainly your noise though...
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:06:40 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:06:40 PM
If it is a balljoint its most likely the bottom (load carrying) one and I believe that the top one is a non-serviceable type meaning you would have to replace the whole upper control arm. If I was you I would replace the sway bar link bushings and see if that fixes it. They're like $20 some bucks and by the looks of yours it needs done.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:11:57 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:11:57 PM
Yea thats what im planning on doing, im gonna replace the whole sway bar link (given its not too hard to do - dosent look like it) I found the parts pretty cheap too. I did try and move the tire when i had it jacked up earlier ( i usually jack the car up by the frame anyways) and i couldnt move the wheel at all so thats a good sign of not having bad ball joints. By looking at the stabilizer link it looks like i can just take the 2 nuts off of the threaded part of each end and kinda slide it out - is there anything esle to it besides that?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:15:32 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:15:32 PM
Thats about it, easy to do.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:17:42 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:17:42 PM
Awesome. Just orded the parts. Thanks for all the help everybody - you guys are great.:bowdown:
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:20:29 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 09:20:29 PM
I could hook you up with some used ones (close to 1000 miles on them) for nothing. lol Just trying to get rid of something use able on my car.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:40:25 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 09:40:25 PM
Pm me with a price
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:33:15 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:33:15 PM
which ones does yours look like?
#1
#2
#1
#2
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 10:50:09 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 18, 2009, 10:50:09 PM
is this more of what it looks like?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:53:31 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:53:31 PM
I think yours is more like the first one, just doesnt have the goofy bend in it.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:56:05 PM
Post by: Rcarder407 on February 18, 2009, 10:56:05 PM
I got the pics from the autozone website so idk how accurate they are. lol
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 19, 2009, 07:59:41 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 19, 2009, 07:59:41 AM
The only problem you'll have when changing 'em is that they have a tapered shaft on 'em, just like ball joints and tie rod ends. This means that when you remove the nuts they're not going to simply fall out. You might need a tie rod end separator tool.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:02:20 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:02:20 PM
tie rod end seperator tool?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:04:40 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:04:40 PM
.....or this?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:49:34 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 06:49:34 PM
Ive tried using the seperator tool (the second picture) and it didnt work. I put the forks behind the shaft and pulled and pryed but no go. Maybe im doing it wrong???
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 07:02:50 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 07:02:50 PM
Tried again and bent the forks on the seperator tool....
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 07:53:08 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 07:53:08 PM
Has ANYBODY ever done this on an mn-12?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 22, 2009, 08:36:23 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 22, 2009, 08:36:23 PM
I've done it. Told you it wouldn't just fall apart :hick:
With the second tool ("pickle fork") you don't pry, you beat. Put the fork on the joint, beat the end of the handle to drive the fork in deeper. The wedge shape of the tool should separate the joint. This is assuming you've got a small pickle fork that actually will wedge itself in.
The first tool works too, but you might not be able to get it in place.
When in doubt there's always heat. If you have access to a torch you can heat the joint (heat the part the link goes into, not the link itself). When the part gets hot it should release its grip on the link. Just don't heat the sway bar end too much.
With the second tool ("pickle fork") you don't pry, you beat. Put the fork on the joint, beat the end of the handle to drive the fork in deeper. The wedge shape of the tool should separate the joint. This is assuming you've got a small pickle fork that actually will wedge itself in.
The first tool works too, but you might not be able to get it in place.
When in doubt there's always heat. If you have access to a torch you can heat the joint (heat the part the link goes into, not the link itself). When the part gets hot it should release its grip on the link. Just don't heat the sway bar end too much.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 22, 2009, 08:44:39 PM
Post by: mjbtbrd on February 22, 2009, 08:44:39 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;258126
With the second tool ("pickle fork") you don't pry, you beat. Put the fork on the joint, beat the end of the handle to drive the fork in deeper. The wedge shape of the tool should separate the joint. This is assuming you've got a small pickle fork that actually will wedge itself in.
video of pickle fork use on tie rod end....pics may help
http://www.ehow.com/video_2327949_remove-tie-rods.html
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 09:13:21 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 09:13:21 PM
Quote
I've done it. Told you it wouldn't just fall apart
Yea lol experience knows best.... got any tips for the bottom part? just got the top off havin a little trouble (well a lot lol) with the bottom
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 22, 2009, 09:43:37 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 22, 2009, 09:43:37 PM
Same thing: Wedge the pickle fork in between the sway bar and the link, then beat the holy bejeesus out of it.
Experience may know best, but this is 15 year old experience. I did it on my '91 back in '94.
Experience may know best, but this is 15 year old experience. I did it on my '91 back in '94.
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 10:21:49 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 10:21:49 PM
Well i succesfully removed and replaced my sway bar links....:D Took it for a drive, purposely found potholes.......problem solved. No more annoying clanging. However, a new problem arises......my anti-lock light is now on. Coincidence maybe?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 11:19:43 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 22, 2009, 11:19:43 PM
I was just thinking, maybe i hit one (or both ) of my wheel sensors and knocked them out of place - sound about right?
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 23, 2009, 07:43:17 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on February 23, 2009, 07:43:17 AM
About the only way to tell would be put a scanner on it and check for codes. Without a scanner you can do a visual (look for broken wires) but unless it's something obvious it's just a shoot
Title: Sway bar links done...ABS light on....
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 23, 2009, 07:09:35 PM
Post by: 20thanniver-ls on February 23, 2009, 07:09:35 PM
Yea i beat the hell out of the links while taking themn off im almost positive that i hit other stuff too.....but you are right the only sure way is to scan it...