Anybody installed them? Anybody taken pics? Thanks.
Here is a pic I took over the weekend with the prototype SFC's with the braces I installed oh....10 years ago...
(http://www.turbochuck.com/images/Tbird/exhaust.JPG)
The main tubes on this car are only 4' long, but you can use about 5' really. (I was limited at the time by what the boss wanted to do). It doesn't matter now that they are tied into the jacking rails and the cage.
At the back I always angled the end so it would extend over the drop in the rear SF to get more weld area. The SF doesn't dip down like this on Mustangs.
Hell, I don't think I ever took any pictures of mine after I installed them.
Car's at the shop for final suspension work and the suspension will be finished (yaright). The welder would like some more info on the SFCs.
Chuck, does yours have the small flat and z-plates? Can you take a pic from the side to better show the cross braces? TIA
Red_LX, get on it!:D
Do what to who? What plates are you talking about?
They aren't that difficult honestly. The crossbars are stamped "D" and "P" and they bolt up under the seat studs with the cutout at the front. The studs will most likley need to be replaced with bolts as the studs are short. 8mm and 12mm are the bolt sizes, both need to be about 40mm long. You may need a spacer between the crossbar and the floor on the 8mm bolt ( The lip on the reinforcement plate for the bolt is taller than the threaded boss in the floorpan, you'll see it when the crossbar is put in place).
The main tubes are just about 5' long pieces of 2" wide steel that run from front to back, no bends or offsets.
Put the crossbars under the seat studs, put the main tube in place and line it up like you want it. Tack the crossbars in place and then take them down for welding. Coat them the SFC's at this point if you desire. Put whole assy back up under car and weld in place (after prepping areas to weld).
You can add side plate on the subframes if you like, or not.
Not sure what info this guy needs, it's not rocket science honestly.
Hmmm, I have the MM full-length for a Mustang (some dope at MM told me they would fit as shipped) but I had to bash them with a full sledge hammer 'till they were nearly straight (which made me feel like an idiot when I realized that straight rectangular tubing was all that was needed). It looks like I may be able to slide the cross-braces in the gap between where they are welded to the torque-boxes and the floorpan. Then again, I welded the tubes to anything and everything so I may not be able to slide them into place - I need to check. I noticed in the other thread that you still had some left...
Which makes me wonder why MM doesn't make full length SFCs for our cars...
Because...
The only reason KB did them was because I did all the work and said.. "Hey, here's a product we could sell some of". They actually cost less than the Mustang one's to make....and they insisted on charging more.
I didn't weld them in yet. I still need to seam seal and finish coat the floor before I install them for good.
If you look hard you can see them in there.
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/frame%20rails%20and%20connectors/IMG_3392.jpg)
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/frame%20rails%20and%20connectors/IMG_3394.jpg)
Had to put it on a angle, because of the floor being angled.
(http://i233.photobucket.com/albums/ee79/daminc/frame%20rails%20and%20connectors/IMG_3398.jpg)
That's the way they are supposed to be, angled. If you notice (on an unmodded set) the height of the front of the brace (above the notch) is about 1/2" more than the rear of the brace.
Then I guess I did it right. I was starting to worry that something was bent. seeing I had to build a lot of the floor on that side, I don't know what it really should look like. I wish I had something to copy when I made that side.
The guy knows cars but not so familiar with Foxes. I think the big issues are the side plates and cross braces.
I was hoping for some pics like this but better detail
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/10/web/478000-478999/watermark_478078_364_full.jpg
I got the SFCs a while back on TF and the instructions are .. minimalist. To make matters worse, I dropped off the car and wasn't able to actually walk him through what's what. He's just got a pile of parts sitting next to his welder and lift.
Chuck, thanks for mentioning the angle. I didn't know that about that either.
Thanks for all the pics.
Those are some nice looking braces you made there.... You will notice a difference for certain.
That should car should handle realy nice with all that stuff looks good.
Thanks,
As long as I'm rebuilding the car, should I use the CC plates coming up? also, I'm also thinking of making tower braces for the front end.
And motor mounts, when the next batch happens
Well the CC plates are still uncertain on a timetable at the moment. Kind of buried under a bunch of stuff.
LOL, Thats ok for me. I don't know when I'm tearing apart the front end. I have to make a back end first.
Battery and parking brake cables not secured yet. The welder sprayed black to protect the welds.
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16403&stc=1&d=1214618408)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16404&stc=1&d=1214618408)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16405&stc=1&d=1214618408)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16409&stc=1&d=1214618876)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16410&stc=1&d=1214618876)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16411&stc=1&d=1214618876)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16412&stc=1&d=1214619002)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16413&stc=1&d=1214619002)
how far into the front channel do those run? i dont see any plug welds thru the channel
If I remember correctly, there's an anti-crush sleeve about 10" in.
Thats why I cut the frame bottom off and notched the SF another 10" on the bottom of the frame. I made mine almost a full 5' long
welded inside the frame from inside the car and outside the full length of the frame. plus welded the floor to the frame.
Hmm, good question, maybe 2-3 inches into the front sub? I stuck a coathanger wire in there to try to feel for the front end of the connector, no way I can see for sure w/out drilling.
do you remember how long they were?
t3skidoo-
Why did you have to chop up the crossbraces? Oh wait....you have them installed backwards...
I see what the deal is now. You put the front part of the SFC into the front subframe instead of below it. To be honest, you might have been better off to cut the crossbrace in two and mate it up/weld it to the sides of the main tubes.
At one point he asked about notching the cross braces so they'd fit, but I don't know if he did.
Of course, the purpose of this thread in the first place was to avoid having to undo everything with a cut-off wheel and a cutting torch.:flame:
I explained how the crossbars were "supposed" to be installed. However, with the recessed or "unique" installations, there are some tweaks that need to be made.
If you had these installed for you, the guy didn't really serve you well with the install.
Not accurately enough to measure the unseen part.
yeah, that's possible. question is, what to do at this point? leave it, s it, modify it?
I say go for the gold, jacking rails and cross-braces
5.8fastcat has pics in his Eliminator build thread. As well as Gumby's. I've looked at both and summised that fastcat's are easier to install, but Gumby's are probably more sturdy. old news, maybe.
Hard to say what to do. It's highly possible that at the front, the only attachment is around where he stuffed the tubing into the front subframe.
At the seat braces, the little welds that he did instead of just bolting the braces to the studs look kind of bad as well.
The install on my '83 is OLD...10 years perhaps. If I ever get around to doing SFC's on the '80, they will be like gumby did.
A couple ideas. First see how far the material goes into the front subframe and perhaps use a 3/4"-1" hole saw to cut through the outer material (not the SFC material) and weld at the holes to get more surface area welded. On the seat braces, where he took the easy way out by chopping the end off, instead of modding the notch, weld a piece of flat plate with a hole in it and actually bolt the studs to the crossbraces.