http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FirstDrives/articleId=124470
Well, there you have it.
Chrysler builds yet another performance car that weighs over 4,000 lbs and isn't available with a manual transmission.
To be honest, I don't really like the front end of the car. The massive, solid bumper design just seems out of proportion to the inset grille and headlights. I think "big chin" whenever I see a shot of the front.
Now that ya mention it, it is kinda big-chinned LOL
I still can't wait to see em on the streets. Couple guys at the local Fri and Sat night wendy's lot hangout I'm almost positive will each have one, the one is a HUGE mopar nut, last year he was talkin my ear off practically listing off the entire build sheet he was planning lol. I hope he gets what he wants!
It's the leno Adition!
I actualy like it, but sucks it's so heavy and you cant get a stick.
i like the cluster.
*yawn* Huh? What?
Sorry, I fell asleep reading that ..... Yay...another canned retro grab.....
If they are gonna make is 4,000 Pounds
Needs a spoogings Turbo Diesel XD
It looks great........ on the outside.
I would drive it if it came in the bright dodge green.
I would drive it if it was made by ford and called the Mercury Cougar and looked like a 1970 Mercury Cougar. ........:hick:
Isn't the Shelby GT500 dangerously close to 4000 pounds?
In this age of mobile office/livingroom/bedroom/spa/entertainment center cars full of airbags, ABS, and other nanny-the-occupants safety gear 4000 pound cars are going to become the norm, not the exception. I think a modern Civic weighs almost as much as a Fox Birdcat...
At least not yet. All 2008 models will be automatics only, but 2009 models will have a Tremec 6-speed manual available.
I completely agree, the overall shape of the car screams vintage E-Body but it just looks like a much "chunkier" version of the original. ;)
Brent
:cougarsmily:
It's gonna be a close choice between a 2009 Challenger R/T with a manual and a Mustang Shelby GT when I get out of school. :burnout:
I think it looks good.
It's got a big @ss though...
They need a platform they can put the 6.1 in that weighs less than 3500 pounds.....
Exactly, I just checked the door tag on my Tib and she taps out at 3836 lbs. Add my ass to the driver's seat and she's over 4000 :fart:
thats GVWR gross weight. that includes your ass. as well as yur passengers and a full tank of fuel.
I agree.
I watched that video. Either that guy is small or the Challenger is HUGE!...yikes!
I thought my 460 Turbo Coupe was heavy at 3,400 lbs, but now I don't feel so bad compared to the 4,000 lb plus Challenger.
I think it's hot and it IS a Challenger like the Mustang IS a Mustang these days, weight is irrelevant, it's all about appearance and performance.
and Unlike the 04 GTO (from another thread) that is just a ricer wanna-be
Ricer
WHAT? Ok, I know you're just trolling now. ;)
It's OK, John and I will drag Jim kicking and screaming to the track and strap him in for some 12-second ET's and see what he says about it then ;)
I think it's pretty slick.
(http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com//media/roadtests/firstdrive/2008/dodge.challenger.srt8/08.dodge.challenger.04.500.jpg)
I heard the production version will get a B pillar the prototype doesn't have....I wonder if the 6000 people with pre-orders know that! :)
Not trolling at all, It's my opinion and I'm stuck with it, your not. The GTO
looks just like all the other cookie cutter cars out there with no style, no class... Go look at my link to an ACTUAL GTO in the GTO thread and you will easily see what I'm talking about. Just putting a “GTO” badge on the side does NOT make it a GTO, any more than Chrysler made a Charger with a 4cyl.
Occasionally one comes along that DARES to go against the grain. The Challenger and the Mustang have done that the GTO.. is just another cookie cutter.
Looks like it should get GREAT gas mileage though! (
ß ok… THAT was a jab!)
'Bland' and 'Ricer Wannabe' are two very different things. The sad thing is, if they had designed it to be as brash as the later classic GTO's, it would have been even more expensive than it already was. Pontiac just wanted the car on their lot, but couldn't change the Holden body without jacking the price way beyond what anyone was willing to spend on a Pontiac. So instead, they ended up with something more like the first Tempest GTO. A Tempest with a big motor, just like this looked like a Cavalier with a lot of motor and RWD.
This is the opposite of a ricer, though. The Challenger is more of a ricer, actually, packing all that Muscle car styling and Hemi power, with a slushbox to push. Still, I wouldn't call either of them Rice.
Me too. I think it looks awesome inside and out.
+ 3 on the "sick"
I really like the way the car looks and it sure is fun to see the 05 and later Mustang and the 08 Challenger break from the cookie cutter style and finally show that cars don't all have to look the same. They both have class and a style that will last for years.
Too bad the new Camaro won't look more like the 69 Camaro. If it did, now that would really be fun!
I'll take two please. Finaly, mustang competition. I like the new stangs allot as well. These are the kind of cars allot of us have been dreaming of seeing. Old school style and new school performance.
... or anymore than you can but a T-Bird badge on a Fox bird and call it a T-Bird.
Go look at a 57 and you'll see what I'm talking about, LOL... Your argument doesn't hold water.
I dig the new Challenger. I think it's a toss up whether I'd buy that or a GT500. But I'd probably wait for the new Camaro before I actually made a decision and by then I could pick up a used C6 Vette for close to the same price. Fortunately I'm broke so I will continue to drive my non-retro styled almost classic Fox T-Bird.
Yeah. Denial doesn't change facts. That's a GTO and there was a 4-cylinder Charger.
So..who owns what's left of AMC? Now it's their turn to puke out another retro-inspired "Javelin" because no one can come up with a new idea to save their asses these days.
Then what you do is take all these retro-inspired turds and restart the old Trans Am series. I mean come on...the Mustang, the Challenger, the Camaro and the Javelin....that would be the shiznit!(insert eye-rolling smiley here.....).
I am so sick of this "retro" .....big, heavy, lumbering turds that are so wholly unoriginal it's pathetic.
Retro sells, Chuck. Last I saw you were driving cars at least twenty years old. The buying public hasn't rewarded the Domestics for coming up with new and original designs in a very long time (Aztec anyone?), so when they go retro the things fly off the lot (I can't say that for the SS-R, though). Maybe the reason people love retro so much is because they show styling that is instantly recognizable as coming from 'such and such', as opposed to the generic featureless look of everything modern.
The challenger looks like a Dodge. The Neon looked like a Neon. The New Beetle looks like a Volkswagen. The Passat looks like the Five Hundred......... I mean Passat. The T-bird looked like a T-bird when it was an MN-12, but when the retro bird came out, it looked like a Ford.
For every Retro car on the street, there are fifteen other boring modern cars ripping around, and we all know what car people are staring at. That's you too, Chuck, unless you consider the Camry eye catching.
I don't buy canned retro....I drive REAL retro.....
The question is..where do you go from a retro design? To another one? So what, is the EcoBoosted 2011 Mustang going to be a '76 Mustang inspired piece?
That is the real problem with retro. Just ask VW. ;) Their big update to the Beetle was a less smiley bumper and some revised head/tail lights. I've seen some sketches of what was expected of the next Mustang, and it looks like ass. They tried to modernize the already modernized retro, and it looks like it has an identity complex.
But retro works, so long as you don't try to update it. But then you're stuck with a design. That's why these retro cars should be short runs. When it gets to long in tooth, reinvent. Like the Retro T-bird, I don't think anyone wants to see an update of that thing, but it's cool as its own series. 'The' Retro T-bird, not 'a'. The Thunderbird should come back as a long coupe with an arse, and we can remember the retros as a collector look back at the glory days.
Right, modern retro is a fad that I wish would go away. They "design" themselves (or copy themselves) into a hole that they can't get out of.
How "unique" is a modern retro when there are thousands of them running around? Not very. Still just as "cookie-cutter" as everything else when it comes down to it, they just used an older mold and mashed it a bit.
This is what they should have made 615RWHP but NO they did not this is the concept the yshould have made.
I found this sort of interesting.
A friend of mine who is a lifelong Mopar guy and owns 11 Mopars and one Ford.
’07 Shelby GT500
’06 Charger R/T
’05 Ram Quad Cab 4X4
’03 Jeep Grand Cherokee
’01 Intrepid R/T
’93 Dodge Daytona IROC R/T
’71 Plymouth Sport Fury GT 440 6-pack
’71 Dodge Charger R/T 440
’71 Dodge Challenger R/T 340
’70 Dodge Challenger R/T 440 6-Pack
’70 Plymouth ‘Cuda convertible 340
’69 Dodge Polara 500
He originally planned on getting a Challenger SRT, but he said after seeing the production version and then seeing a GT500KR in person on the same day at the Chicago Auto Show, he said he just doesn’t like the Challenger as well as he thought he would.
He said the Challenger is just big and “heavy looking”, especially in the front & rear bumper areas of the car. But the stance and the “meanness” of the GT500KR is just right, and has decided to sell his '07 GT500 to get a KR.
I have to agree with him, but it surprises me a little coming from a lifelong Mopar guy that he still is choosing the KR over the Challenger.
Brent
:cougarsmily:
This is exactly how I feel. The side profile of the car looks just fine to me, but the front end just looks so stupid. It reminds me of a bulldog, to be honest. The grille and headlights are just too high, if that makes any sense.
They got the design right the first time.
All this talk about heavy safety laden cars (& highways filled with massive SUV's) contrasted with the retro muscle car phenomenon reminds me of the song "Red Barchetta" by Rush.
Makes you think...
I love that Rush song "Red Barchetta".
Love to crank it up!!
I cranked it up on my big electrostats after reading this post :D
Funny, The Daily Show was making a joke about "Rush" and they showed a video clip of Geddy Lee singing Tom Sawyer :hick: "not that Rush" said John Stuart, "my producer loves Rush, he's got pictures of them all over his office" :headbang: :canada:
Ah...your wish is our command: :)
http://jalopnik.com/356151/american-motors-corporation-is-back-no-not-really
(http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2008/02/Screw_You_Hot_Rod_Readers.jpg)
Kinda tough times to be a designer or manufacturer. Nobody wants futuristic, everybody thinks current is boring, and retro has just about jumped the shark.
I actually somewhat like the Challenger, though it's a pity Plymouth died because a retro Cuda would have been way cooler. The Challenger isn't perfect, of course, but with modern crash standards it's kinda hard to be perfect. Likewise, with modern expectations of content and structural rigidity it's hard to be lightweight.
I think the jump has been completed...
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/51/Fonzie_jumps_the_shark.PNG)
(http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/images/icons/icon14.gif) Ayyy-yy-y! (http://www.foxtbirdcougarforums.com/images/icons/icon14.gif)
Heres a picture of one in my town theres also a orange one with custom wheels and exhaust allready on there 2nd set of rims will get a picture of the other one 1 day soon maybe.
Ooooh, haven't seen one in black. That's bad ass!
I see these things all the time now......
They're F-ing Big!
A comparitive photo:
ITs hot in black.....
Yeah I've seen quite a few here. They look a bit porky in person.
The new Challengers look awesome in my opinion. Kinda sux no stick but maybe they will come out with them in a couple years. Now I need to vent:
I get so tired of people bitching about retro...there is a good reason retro is so hot right now. Muscle cars of the '60s and '70s were the best era of cars ever (I think 1969 was the best year for cars period). There were just good looking cars from every manufacturer. I think we have some awesome new cars out there right now and in 30 yrs people will be collecting them just like they are the originals. Plus with the shape our domestic auto makers are in I think its great they have such exciting halo cars to help boost sales somewhere while truck/SUV sales fall.
And on another note while driving my '07 'stang some folks may think its too "cookie cutter" but thats no worse than people seeing me in my T-bird and thinking its a white trash mobile...not because mine is a POS, but because its rare to see one these days not being destroyed slowly by a mullet wearing, PBR drinking, long haired friend of Jesus and it kinda gives people a mindset ya know? The retro cars we all want will never happen anyway...a new Fox-bodyesque T-bird or Cougar with RWD!
I do not beleive the challenger will come out with a stick ever. look at the magnum and charger... still no stick there. How ever i do like the challenger as it seems to be one of the best retro's to date imo. 2nd to the gt lol we had an orange SRT8 that i beleive was the 5th one produced... nice car.
Wheres the green ones and purple ones like the old school hemis.
Now all the world is waiting on is the new Camaros which if i go watch the transformers again i might have to get a 2nd job and loan to get one.
At the end of the day ford did it right by making the newer mustangs and everylast part company that makes parts for them did a hell of a job on making it one of the nicest bolt on cars in the world.
But there is a probelm here ford guys Steve Saleen went of and made a company called SMS and has a 500HP and 700HP version of the new challengers.
The 2009's are available with a stick. (21X package. Go to the dodge website and check it out) They're also available with a Posi. They brought this thing out a year early, in my opinion. I feel bad for all the suckers who paided ( ;) ) $20g+ over MSRP to have one of the first year Challengers, but the guys who waited a year got the manual tranny and LSD, and probably didn't pay a quarter as much of a mark-up. ...kind of. If you need to be the first guy on the block to have one, and don't have a clue what's going on with the car's production specs/schedule, you probably deserve to be suckered.
i am honestly suprised to see a stickshift. i do think it should be an option in magnum and charger vehicles as well
In case no one has seen this yet...the first (?) photo of the Big 3 Retro Cars:
(http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/12/2008/08/494x_Muscle-Car-Wars-Threesome.jpg)
Linky: http://jalopnik.com/5041442/exclusive-first-photo-of-detroits-new-muscle-car-threesome
I saw that article the other day. BTW, that's a pre-production Camaro. The production version doesn't have the shiznitty headlights and wheels you see there.
There are 3 of them out here by me that come though the lots. 2 Orange, 1 silver but they dont want to run em. My buddy has an 05 GTO and we try every weekend but they wont. We just want to see one run win or lose
On the Dodge website, you can build one w/either the 5.7L w/a 5spd or the (big?) 6.1 w/a 6spd, autos available as an option. (don't want to mention the little 3.5L V6auto option)
I like the way they look, the wife told me about them when they were shown at the Chicago Auto Show. She fell in love with them and now wants one instead of the Jaguar XKR. Glad she'll be paying for it :D
Hey, for an EXTRA $70K you can turn your Challenger into a 'Cuda!
http://hxcperformance.com/
This is beyond crazy...
Look how small the Mustang looks next to the Challenger and Camaro. No wonder these cars need over 400 HP to run the numbers that Fox Stangs were achieving with less than 250 HP. I can't wait to embarrass one with my 86 T-Bird, LOL :D (Just to be clear... By "embarrass" I mean "run with", which is good enough for me and plenty embarrassing for them.)
I never thought I'd see the day where our cars would actually have a HP/Wt advantage.
The HXC Cuda looks killer but if you could take it add the Saleen SMS 700hp set-up and paint it like a AAR with custom side exhaust it would look sick.
:cheers: That would definitely look sick!
There's an orange one in the car lot on my way to work and home that I see everyday. And every time I drive past I can't help but think, "it needs a bumper" The rounded off nose in all orange just doesn't do it for me. Then again, I grew up riding in a '71 Cuda. But it might be just the orange being overbearing.
Not quite.
The 5.7L R/T & 6.1L SRT-8 both come standard with 5-speed Automatics and a 6-speed manual is optional.
Brent
:cougarsmily:
I like it a lot.It's better than a front drive V-6 4 door.
The new Camaro is the first good looking Camaro in decades! I can't believe how heavy all these "pony" cars are though.
I saw one today on the way to class. They just bought it too, it still has the paper tags on it. It was just a V6 though. :hick:
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a38/cb400f75/Misc/Photo0004.jpg)
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a38/cb400f75/Misc/Photo0005.jpg)
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a38/cb400f75/Misc/Photo0006.jpg)
That looks very cool!
What does the grille say? It looks pretty stout even for a V6 car!
The grill just says "Challenger." If it's a R/T or SRT8 then it says in the grill.
I saw an Orange SRT8 this weekend with the 6.1 and a 6-speed. That thing was bad! They had just put the 30 day tags on it, and were cruising the lake. The Challenger is the only retro-themed car that I like. The Camaro is bleh, not a fan. I am really not a fan of the Mustang, its the worst throwback made. Im not even big on HOT ROD's Chevelle concept. Now if they came out with the AMC retros like HOT ROD showed, now that would be fockin suweet! Id like to see a Cuda or something like a Road Runner or GTX throwback.
Not a ricer. It's Aussie. Look at the Holden Monaro, then the GTO. The GTO was nothing but a Monaro with a Pontiac shield popped on in place of the Lion's Head of Holden. That car has some serious muscle under the "bonnet". It's very subtle, though, and well hidden. The Aussies are rev-heads just like us, even when their fuel was 4X the price of ours. Believe it or not, you can still buy premium LEADED fuel in Oz.