General => Lounge => Topic started by: quicksilver on November 11, 2007, 09:24:52 PM
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: quicksilver on November 11, 2007, 09:24:52 PM
the friend my father bought the car from (the original owner from 1988-2001) said that in the earlier 1990's (cant remember the year he said) the car was recalled for a motor problem and got sent in and had a new motor put in it.
also my head light holders ( the frame part) says E7 on it. i thought that was a mustang thing.
and on top of my engine bay, right infront of the windshield, centered in the middle, it sas E3SB. what does that mean?
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Beau on November 11, 2007, 09:38:55 PM
Was the car originally a 3.8? That's the only recall I've ever heard of, and I thought it was in the early 90's...
The E7 and E3 are year codes of Ford The letters are alphabet for the year...E=8 in this case...E7 heads for example first came on 1987 truck and Stang (HO) 5.0 engines...the E6 (High Swirl) heads on the 86 5.0 were not as performance oriented.
The letter is the decade, with e being 8, f is 9, and so on...the second number equates to the particular year.
The reason your headlights have the e7 marking...87 is when the castings were first made for the Tbird/Cougars (at least with the aero front lights)
That's why an '88 might have an e7 code...probably most were made in 1987, before the big re-tooling up got the MN-12 in 1989. All of the lights on mine, and even when I went to the TC inners have ALL had E7 on them...maybe they didn't even mold any lights in 1988??
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 11, 2007, 10:07:31 PM
These are the recalls that I have (not including Turbo Coupe):
Cougar/XR7 V8-302 5.0L General Recalls 1. 93B31 DEC 93 Throttle Body Lever Grommet - Recall 93B31
The headlight part number would be correct (1987). The E3SB on your cowl piece...are you sure that's not E8? Generally (and I use this term loosely because, as we all know, Ford will do illogical things without warning) that indicates model year of the car. The 1983 and 1984 had an ink stamp on the cowl, right behind the engine. I believe starting in 1985 the number (E5, E6, etc.) was physically stamped on top of the cowl like that. My convertible has a big E6 there. I think you *should* have an E8, or E8SE, because otherwise I'd have no idea why a 1983-stamped cowl piece (which was never stamped with E3) is on your car...
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Carpimp1987 on November 11, 2007, 11:27:23 PM
Eric is there much or anything about our cars you don't know about?
Thank you for making coolcats.net and answering our ?s.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 12, 2007, 12:12:45 AM
LOL...believe me, I'm still learning a lot...but thanks. ;)
Oh, the original question, forgot to answer that one. There was a phenomenon with the 5.0 engine beginning in 1986 where the factory aluminum pistons were slightly undersized--on purpose. The theory was that, as the engine warmed up, the pistons would expand to the "normal" size. Unfortunately when the engine was cold, two things would happen: some oil usage, as oil would slip by the piston rings; and the dreaded dieseling/pinging noise. Ford considered both conditions as normal--I know, that's just sooooo shocking LOL. The engines in question were the non-HO 5.0 version used in our cars, the 1986 Mustang GT/Capri 5.0, Crown Vic, Grandpa Marquis, and Town Car, plus the F-150. In 1987 with the use of forged pistons in HO motors and the trucks, the problem went away. But for the other cars the knocking and oil usage persisted until either the engine was axed in the product cycle or was replaced with the HO version.
However...if a customer complained enough, Ford dealerships were authorized to replace the entire engine under warranty. It was all a matter of how much they complained, though. Some dealerships were not so generous, even though it was well within their authorized ability to change out the motor.
Anyhow, that's how that came to be. Some engines have a pr0nounced knock on cold startup, like my old '88 XR7 did. Others, like my old '88 T-Bird Sport, never had a knock. It was a flip of the coin. I don't think this problem existed in the 3.8 V6 or the turbo-4 engine so if you have the 5.0 in your car, quicksilver, that's probably what happened.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: cougrrr302 on November 12, 2007, 12:32:24 AM
After purchasing my Cougar for my Uncle in 1986, my family(grandparents or parents) recieved a letter from Ford recalling my Cats. Said to bring it to a Ford dealer and they would be replaced... We never did because it was in storage over a 14 year period.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: quicksilver on November 12, 2007, 12:41:44 AM
the friend my father bought the car from was friends with a dealership owner, so he wouldnt have to complain if he did get a new motor.... but if he really did get a new motor, would it just be the SO or HO?
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 12, 2007, 09:12:28 AM
The SO, because the HO would have required a new computer, wiring, etc. It was just an R&R deal. In some cases the new engine had the same exact problem. :)
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: 32VFoxBird on November 12, 2007, 09:34:35 AM
i heard ford put in crate 351 motors for the replacement on the recalls for 88 birds. :burnout:
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Drewstang on November 12, 2007, 10:03:36 AM
Quote from: 32VFoxBird;187171
i heard ford put in crate 351 motors for the replacement on the recalls for 88 birds. :burnout:
LOL
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: shorangerbird on November 12, 2007, 11:40:11 AM
Quote from: EricCoolCats;187109
The E3SB on your cowl piece...are you sure that's not E8? Generally (and I use this term loosely because, as we all know, Ford will do illogical things without warning) that indicates model year of the car.
-the numbers you see on the actual parts are Ford Engineering numbers. they may OR may not be close to the actual service part number. those you find like the above (E3SB) are prolly correct for your car. when a part for a "new" car,(i.e. body/model/etc.) is engineered, such as the "AERO" birds first produced in 1983, the engineering number will be along those lines(E3SB) and IF they continue to use that particular part for the life of the car until its changed(AERO made until 1988 and then ALL NEW body/model (MN-12) engineered for 1989) and there are no updates/changes to that particular part, the engineering number will never change, even though it is used from 1983-1988. clear as mud???? so even though a part is first made for a particular model year, it can last many years in service and even DIFFERENT cars, especially mechanical parts. trim and things seen by the eye are ususally different between models, but underneath, alot can be shared. if they update or improve upon an original part, they WILL change the engineering number to the year they improved it(E3SB updated in 85 would make it E5SB) to show the latest change......
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: thunderjet302 on November 12, 2007, 01:45:18 PM
Quote from: EricCoolCats;187169
The SO, because the HO would have required a new computer, wiring, etc. It was just an R&R deal. In some cases the new engine had the same exact problem. :)
Just a new computer. The wiring is the same ;)
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Beau on November 12, 2007, 04:37:14 PM
Quote from: shorangerbird;187186
even though a part is first made for a particular model year, it can last many years in service and even DIFFERENT cars
Exactly...E7 heads were used on trucks, HO5.0's, from 1987 till...well, I guess until the intro of the Mod engines. Hey, we're talking about Ford stuff here...clear!? HA! :hick:
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 12, 2007, 04:43:48 PM
Okay...reread this again:
Quote
The 1983 and 1984 had an ink stamp on the cowl, right behind the engine. I believe starting in 1985 the number (E5, E6, etc.) was physically stamped on top of the cowl like that. My convertible has a big E6 there. I think you *should* have an E8, or E8SE, because otherwise I'd have no idea why a 1983-stamped cowl piece (which was never stamped with E3) is on your car...
1983 = ink stamp behind engine 1984 = ink stamp behind engine 1985 = E5 physical stamp on top 1986 = E6 physical stamp on top 1987 = E7 physical stamp on top 1988 = *should have* E8 physical stamp on top
There were exceptions to the rule...late/early models were sometimes holdovers. But I've never seen an '88 with an '83 physical stamp.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: shorangerbird on November 12, 2007, 05:53:28 PM
Quote from: EricCoolCats;187260
1983 = ink stamp behind engine 1984 = ink stamp behind engine 1985 = E5 physical stamp on top 1986 = E6 physical stamp on top 1987 = E7 physical stamp on top 1988 = *should have* E8 physical stamp on top .
-sorry eric, should have made myself more clear also. i was refering to parts, you were refering to body build stampings. BUT if you ARE talking about a physical impression in the sheetmetal, and not an ink stamp, then yes, if the piece was a carry over for all years Aero bird, it COULD be stamped E3SB. i can go to my '88 in the drive and show you E3 stamps IN the metal.... -stu
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 12, 2007, 06:07:49 PM
OK...show us then. ;) I'll do the same with my cars.
The cowl panel theoretically was the same, but there were minor changes. The 1983-86 windshield panel, underneath the wipers, had 2 small bolts holding the panel on at the bottom. In 1987 those holes weren't there anymore. Since the 1983 washer squirters were different there may have been a modified bolt pattern for 1983 only. I've noticed just little things here and there, nothing major, but apparently enough to warrant a new part number when that happened.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: EricCoolCats on November 12, 2007, 06:37:07 PM
OK, some pics...I was mistaken, the ink stamp was on the strut tower. I knew there was a stamp in there somewhere. :) Anyway...
The '84, top of the cowl: (http://www.coolcats.net/ximages/cowlstamp01.jpg)
The '84, behind the motor. Beneath the lip on the cowl piece is a part number stamped in: 4DB54. Guessing the first 4 indicates 1984. There's also a date stamp to the left: (http://www.coolcats.net/ximages/cowlstamp02.jpg)
The '84, ink stamp on the strut tower: (http://www.coolcats.net/ximages/cowlstamp03.jpg)
The '86, top of the cowl (E6LB): (http://www.coolcats.net/ximages/cowlstamp04.jpg)
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: 5.0 tbird on November 12, 2007, 07:17:51 PM
That's a Lincoln casting number on the 86 cowl. I guess the Cougars shared cowls with the Mark VII
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: TurboCoupe50 on November 12, 2007, 07:58:43 PM
Don't see a number on my '88s, but I've seen that E3 #... Somewhere... But probably not on my cars...
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Innes on November 13, 2007, 07:50:51 AM
Again ill say it Eric you’re good To bad coolcats wasn’t coolbirds though
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: shorangerbird on November 13, 2007, 10:05:20 AM
Quote from: EricCoolCats;187271
OK...show us then. ;).
-will do, but it will be this weekend. i leave for work in the dark, and get home in the dark. my digi cam works, but the flash doesnt. spend too much money on cars to buy new camera:D . but will get some sat....4 sure.
Title: Recalls
Post by: t.birdsc on November 14, 2007, 02:44:58 AM
Quote from: quicksilver;187097
the friend my father bought the car from (the original owner from 1988-2001) said that in the earlier 1990's (cant remember the year he said) the car was recalled for a motor problem and got sent in and had a new motor put in it
If you call a Ford dealer and catch a service writer in a helpful mood :hick: they could run your vin # in the system and see if there are any open recalls on it. Remember, programs expire recalls don't. Funny you should mention recalls; recently one came in the mail on my '93 Bronco that has 193,000 miles on it. Something about the the brake light switch for the cruise catching fire. After having problems finding a cruise control servo that would work for a decent length of time, I'm somewhat reluctant to 'bring it in' :flame:
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Beau on November 14, 2007, 03:17:16 AM
Quote from: t.birdsc;187482
Funny you should mention recalls; recently one came in the mail on my '93 Bronco that has 193,000 miles on it. Something about the the brake light switch for the cruise catching fire.
You really should check into this, it's quite a big deal, a lot of trucks have been totalled by fire for this. http://www.floridapersonalinjury-attorney.com/ford_recall.html
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Jim_Miller on November 14, 2007, 11:14:34 AM
Quote from: t.birdsc;187482
programs expire recalls don't.
Explain Please
My 91 F250 4x4 has a issue with Dual tanks, One bleeds through to the other. If I fill both tanks, drive on the forward to half a tank then remove the cap on the rear tank Fuel gushes out all over the place and me.
There is a recall on this…
Quote
Make : FORD
Model : F250 Year : 1991 Manufacturer : FORD MOTOR COMPANY
NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 01I008000 Mfr's Report Date : JUL 19, 2001 Component: FUEL SYSTEM, GASOLINE Potential Number Of Units Affected : 1556221 Summary: THIS IS NOT A SAFETY RECALL IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE SAFETY ACT. HOWEVER, IT IS DEEMED A SAFETY IMPROVEMENT CAMPAIGN BY THE AGENCY. VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: 1990-1993 FORD F-SERIES VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH DUAL FUEL TANKS AND 4.9, 5.0,5.8, OR 7.5 LITER GASOLINE FUELED ENGINES. SOME VEHICLES CAN EXPERIENCE A CROSS TANK FUEL FLOW CONDITION DUE TO A DAMAGED CHECK VALVE IN THE FUEL PUMP/SENDER ASSEMBLY. FUEL MAY BE SUPPLIED FROM ONE TANK AND SOME OR ALL OF THE UNUSED FUEL MAY BE RETURNED TO THE OTHER TANK. Consequence: SHOULD THIS OCCUR, THE CAPACITY OF THE RECEIVING TANK MAY BE EXCEEDED AND FUEL MAY OVERFLOW FROM THE FILLER CAP. Remedy: FORD IS EXTENDING THE WARRANTY FOR POTENTIAL FUEL CROSS-FLOW TO 12 YEARS OF SERVICE OR 150,000 MILES FROM THE VEHICLE'S WARRANTY START DATE, WHICHEVER OCCURS FIRST. THIS COVER WILL AUTOMATICALLY TRANSFER TO SUBSEQUENT OWNERS AT NO CHARGE. IF A VEHICLE ALREADY HAS MORE THAN 150,000 MILES, THIS OVERAGE WILL LAST UNTIL DECEMBER 31, 2001. IF THE VEHICLE IS EXPERIENCING A FUEL CROSS-FLOW CONDITION, DEALERS WILL REPAIR THE CONDITION FREE OF CHARGE. Notes: FORD HAS DECIDED TO CONDUCT AN EXTENDED COVERAGE PROGRAM TO EXTEND THE WARRANTY COVERAGE FOR POTENTIAL FUEL CROSS FLOW PROBLEMS. OWNERS CAN CONTACT FORD AT 1-866-436-7332, CONCERNING THIS PROGRAM.
Are you saying that Ford will honor this even though this says December 31 2001?
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Jim_Miller on November 14, 2007, 11:20:44 AM
And a little more ON TOPIC,, according to http://www.recalls.gov/ there were two recalls on the 88 Thunderbird
Quote
Make : FORD Model : THUNDERBIRD Year : 1988 Manufacturer : FORD MOTOR COMPANY NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 88V033000 Mfr's Report Date : MAR 11, 1988 Component: POWER TRAIN:AXLE ASSEMBLY:AXLE SHAFT Potential Number Of Units Affected : 682 Summary: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) A DESIGN CHANGE TO FACILITATE CHANGEOVER IN REAR AXLE SHAFT S INADVERTENTLY PRODUCED THE POSSIBILITY FOR INTERFERENCE BETWEEN THE AND DISC BRAKE ROTOR. Consequence: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) THE INTERFERENCE COULD PREVENT PROPER SEATING OF THEROTOR. ALSO AN IMPROPERLY SEATED ROTOR COULD IN TIME RESULT IN A REDUCTION INTHE CLAMPING FORCES OF THE WHEEL STUDS, POSSIBLY LEADING TO FRACTURED STUDSAND REAR WHEEL SEPARATION. Remedy: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) INSPECTION OF VEHICLES AND WHERE NECESSARY REPLACE REAR AXLE SHAFTS AND REAR BRAKE ROTORS. Notes: SYSTEM: AXLE REAR SHAFT /SUSPENSION.VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: PASSENGER CARS.
and
Quote
Make : FORD Model : THUNDERBIRD Year : 1988 Manufacturer : FORD MOTOR COMPANY NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 96V071000 Mfr's Report Date : APR 25, 1996Component: ELECTRICAL SYSTEM:IGNITION Potential Number Of Units Affected : 7900000 Summary: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) THE IGNITION SWITCH COULD EXPERIENCE AN INTERNAL SHORT CIRCUIT. Consequence: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) THIS CONDITION COULD CAUSE OVERHEATING, SMOKE, AND POSSIBLY FIRE IN THE STEERING COLUMN AREA OF THE VEHICLE. Remedy: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE IGNITION SWITCH. Notes: (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/images/spacer.gif) SYSTEM: ELECTRICAL; IGNITION SWITCH. VEHICLE DESCRIPTION: PASSENGER AND MULTI-PURPOSE VEHICLES AND LIGHT DUTY TRUCKS. NOTE: OWNERS WHO TAKE THEIR VEHICLES TO AN AUTHORIZED DEALER ON AN AGREED UPON SERVICE DATE AND DO NOT RECEIVE THE FREE REMEDY WITHIN A REASONABLE TIME, SHOULD CONTACT FORD AT 1-800-392-3673. ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION'S AUTO SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-800-424-9393.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 14, 2007, 03:43:19 PM
Quote from: Jim_Miller;187536
Explain Please
My 91 F250 4x4 has a issue with Dual tanks, One bleeds through to the other. If I fill both tanks, drive on the forward to half a tank then remove the cap on the rear tank Fuel gushes out all over the place and me.
There is a recall on this…
Are you saying that Ford will honor this even though this says December 31 2001?
That is not a true recall, it's a warranty extension (I don't know what Ford calls them, but GM calls them "Customer satisfaction campaigns". A true recall is government mandated and has no expiry (I am still seeing late 70's and early 80's GM's having their backing plates replaced under recall). The NHTSA can only force recalls for safety or emissions reasons, not quality issues, so you'll never see a true recall for something like lousy transmissions or head gaskets.
Another indicator of a true recall is that the manufacturer must repair all affected vehicles whether each particular vehicle has experienced the problem or not. For example, with this dual-tank thing, Ford would have been required to bring in every vehicle covered by the recall and fox whatever causes the cross-flow issue even if the vehicle hasn't experienced it (or, in the case of the ignition switch fires, Ford had to replace ALL switches, not just burned ones). With the warranty extension Ford is only obligated to fix problems as they occur - if your 3.8 blew a head gasket, for example.
A warranty extension has whatever expiry date that the manufacturer decides to put on it. In the case of the warranty extension you quoted - it's good for 12 years or 150k miles from the date the truck was first put into service. Since your 1991 model is well over 12 years old it's no longer eligible.
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Jim_Miller on November 14, 2007, 04:01:32 PM
That sucks, because it does it. I found out the hard way Right after I bought the truck from a friend that had the truck since 95. After refilling the forward tank I was running on, then I decided to top off the rear tank not remembering if there was any fuel in it or not. Fuel came spewing out all down my leg. Peeps at the pumps were looking at me like I was an Oregonian or something. (Oregonians aren’t allowed to pump there own fuel… we Washingtonian’s believe it’s an IQ issue)
Knowing the issue now, I just do like my friend did and always run off the forward tank, and never open the rear until I know it's below 3/4
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: Beau on November 14, 2007, 04:17:51 PM
Jim, have you checked this out over on FTE? There's literally thousands of threads about the fuel crossover problem.
Mine doesn't do it..yet...but I'll be scrooged if it does-my back tank leaks at the seam, I lose gas if it get over 1/2 full in it.
ps. FTE (http://"http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/index.php") is Ford Truck Enthusiasts...
Title: recall for 1988 tbirds?
Post by: 88turbo on November 15, 2007, 04:33:28 PM
Quote from: quicksilver;187097
the friend my father bought the car from (the original owner from 1988-2001) said that in the earlier 1990's (cant remember the year he said) the car was recalled for a motor problem and got sent in and had a new motor put in it.
also my head light holders ( the frame part) says E7 on it. i thought that was a mustang thing.
and on top of my engine bay, right infront of the windshield, centered in the middle, it sas E3SB. what does that mean?
mine shows E8SB but the 8 looks more like a backwards 3 so it could just be the way that it was stamped.